The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

7490 posts
User avatar
Vision
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 5052
Joined: 15 Apr 2004 20:53

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Vision » 24 Mar 2023 03:52

Snowflake Royal
YorkshireRoyal99
Hound
Yep the Stam era was incredibly damaging long term

From misjudging the ability of the young players through to signing crap like Aluko and handing out massive contracts

Absolutely disastrous and yet 2 kicks from the PL


I wonder how much of that actually falls on Stam.

It's not like he was reluctant to bring through youth players, he was responsible for Kelly having a very good season in the lead up to our PO season and always looked to bring through the likes of Sam Smith and others.

Of course there are other examples where we probably haven't utilised them as much as we could/should, but if the owners were looking to bankroll to the PL by signing players who don't have the ability to get there and didn't want youth promoting then his hands were tied.

On Stam, there's

Success:
Omar Richards 0(0) / 9(4) - unqualified success long term.

Mixed:
Liam Kelly 21(9) / 28(6) - great first season, poor second season.
Tom Holmes 0(0) / 1(0) - I'm not sure we can call one appearance much even though he's been a long term success.
Dominic Samuels 6(3) - got a chance and let go, not proved thay wrong
Tennai Watson 0(3) / 0(0) - plagued by injuries, not developed
Sam Smith 0(0)/ 4(4) - didn’t really look good enough, L1 at best

Failure:
Jake Cooper 0(3) / - let go and has arguably passed us
Rob Dickie - let him go, arguably passed us
Dominic Hyam - let him go, arguably passed us
Jack Stacey - let him go, passed us
Tarique Fosu-Henry - let him go, passed us for a while

Now, I may be slightly out and some left us not on Stam's watch, but I've probably missed someone we let go.

For a centreback, Stam seemed to be utterly clueless about what made a good CB, rejecting Cooper, Dickie and Hyam, and bringing in Ilori, Blackett, Oxford and Elphick FFS.


So basically on youth, Stam unjustifiably loved Kelly who was the exception, and otherwise gave out a few cameos and ignored our actual talent.


Goes back to my point about the change in culture once Dai came sniffing around. Pretty much all of those players you list , left after January 2017.

Of course not all of them would have made it under Stam (or anyone else ) but they had no chance once we became a “promotion or bust” club .

Hound
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 24934
Joined: 27 Sep 2016 22:16
Location: Simpleton

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hound » 24 Mar 2023 06:11

Thought all the lot in ‘failure’ left at the start of that first Stam season (cooper on loan)?

Might be wrong though

User avatar
Snowflake Royal
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 39386
Joined: 20 Jun 2017 17:51

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 24 Mar 2023 07:30

Yeah, pretty sure Dickie was first season.

Orion1871
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 3012
Joined: 14 Jul 2020 09:08
Location: Shut up, Dick

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Orion1871 » 24 Mar 2023 08:26

Snowflake Royal Yeah, pretty sure Dickie was first season.


Dickie left on loan to Lincoln at the start of the 2017-18 season. He came back from the loan and Stam gave an interview to getreading saying he wasn't going out on loan again and he wanted Dickie involved in the first team squad and that Dickie had potential.

Dickie was then sold in January 2018.

YorkshireRoyal99
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 5005
Joined: 10 Aug 2017 18:07

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 24 Mar 2023 08:54

Snowflake Royal
YorkshireRoyal99
Hound
Yep the Stam era was incredibly damaging long term

From misjudging the ability of the young players through to signing crap like Aluko and handing out massive contracts

Absolutely disastrous and yet 2 kicks from the PL


I wonder how much of that actually falls on Stam.

It's not like he was reluctant to bring through youth players, he was responsible for Kelly having a very good season in the lead up to our PO season and always looked to bring through the likes of Sam Smith and others.

Of course there are other examples where we probably haven't utilised them as much as we could/should, but if the owners were looking to bankroll to the PL by signing players who don't have the ability to get there and didn't want youth promoting then his hands were tied.

On Stam, there's

Success:
Omar Richards 0(0) / 9(4) - unqualified success long term.

Mixed:
Liam Kelly 21(9) / 28(6) - great first season, poor second season.
Tom Holmes 0(0) / 1(0) - I'm not sure we can call one appearance much even though he's been a long term success.
Dominic Samuels 6(3) - got a chance and let go, not proved thay wrong
Tennai Watson 0(3) / 0(0) - plagued by injuries, not developed
Sam Smith 0(0)/ 4(4) - didn’t really look good enough, L1 at best

Failure:
Jake Cooper 0(3) / - let go and has arguably passed us
Rob Dickie - let him go, arguably passed us
Dominic Hyam - let him go, arguably passed us
Jack Stacey - let him go, passed us
Tarique Fosu-Henry - let him go, passed us for a while

Now, I may be slightly out and some left us not on Stam's watch, but I've probably missed someone we let go.

For a centreback, Stam seemed to be utterly clueless about what made a good CB, rejecting Cooper, Dickie and Hyam, and bringing in Ilori, Blackett, Oxford and Elphick FFS.


So basically on youth, Stam unjustifiably loved Kelly who was the exception, and otherwise gave out a few cameos and ignored our actual talent.


Yeah but you say he bought in Ilori and Oxford, but they've surpassed even Dickie, Hyam and Cooper? Ilori is at Sporting but has been playing top flight football out on loan whereas Oxford has been playing Bundesliga football ever since he left us hasn't he? Wouldn't say he's clueless at what made a good CB based on that.

Elphick was just an experienced defender at this level, not a terrible signing even if his performances weren't great whereas I thought Blackett was pants at LB.

Editing in: For the record, I don't necessarily disagree that we could/should have used them more, but as mentioned once we became a club gambling for promotion we were never going to have the patience the hope a youth player develops if they weren't at the level yet.


User avatar
Sutekh
Hob Nob Super-Addict
Posts: 18383
Joined: 12 Feb 2014 14:05
Location: Undiscovered pyramid somewhere in Egypt

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Sutekh » 24 Mar 2023 09:14

Just thought I’d list the academy prospects that the club have had between 2015-16 and 2019-20 and where they are now. There is a handful missing as I can’t find out info on them and I’ve omitted those that are still playing at Reading that aren’t on loan.

Keepers

Stuart Moore, left 2017, now on loan at Doncaster from Blackpool
Lewis Ward, left 2019, now without a club after being released by Sutton United in January 2023
George Legg, left 2019, now without a club after leaving Thatcham Town in 2021
Luke Southwood, now on loan at Cheltenham
James Holden, left 2022, now on loan at Dulwich Hamlet from Cambridge United

Defenders

Pierce Sweeney, left 2016, now an Exeter City stalwart of some 200 games (signed for Swindon last year and stayed 1 day before returning to Exeter)
Jordan Obita, left 2020, now at Wycombe Wanderers
Sean Long, left 2017, now at Cheltenham Town
Niall Keown, left 2017, believed retired due to injury in 2019
Jake Cooper, left 2017, now Millwall stalwart with around 250 league appearances
Tennai Watson, left 2021, now with Franchise FC
Dominic Hyam, left 2017, now with Blackburn and called up to the latest Scotland squad
Rob Dickie, left 2018, now with QPR
Zak Jules, left 2017, now with Franchise FC
Axel Andrésson, left 2018, now an Icelandic international at Orebro in Denmark
Gabriel Osho, left 2020, now at Luton
Omar Richards, left 2021, now still awaiting his Nottm Forest debut after joining them in 2022
Teddy Howe, left 2020, now with Weymouth
Jeriel Dorset, now on loan at Kilmarnock

Midfielders

Hal Robson-Kanu, left 2015, now without a club after leaving WBA in 2021
Aaron Tshibola, left 2016, now at AEL Limassol
Aaron Kuhl, left 2017, now at Dorking Wanderers
Jack Stacey, left 2017, now a right back at Bournemouth (9 PL apps this season)
Liam Kelly, left 2019, now at Rochdale
Tariq Fosu, left 2017, now on loan at Rotherham from Brentford
Josh Barrett, left 2020, now at King’s Lynn Town
Connor Shaughnessy, left 2016, now at Burton Albion
Samúel Kári Friðjónsson, left 2016, now an Icelandic international at Atrimitos in the Greek Super League
Noor Husin, left 2016, now at Southend United
Lisandro Semedo, left 2016, now a Cape Verde international with Radomiak Radom in Poland
Andy Rinomhota, left 2022, now with Cardiff
Ryan East, left 2021, now at Bradford City
Tyler Frost, left 2020, now at Aldershot Town
Jordan Holsgrove, left 2020, now with Pacos de Ferreira in Portugal
Joel Rollinson, left 2019, now with Hungerford Town
Jokull Andresson, now on loan at Stevenage
Michael Olise, left 2021, now at Crystal Palace (61 apps, 6 goals)

Forwards

Craig Tanner, left 2019, now at Ebbsfleet United
Dominic Samuel, left 2018, now at Ross County
Harry Cardwell, left 2017, now at Southend United
Sam Smith, left 2021, now averaging around 1 goal in 4 games at Cambridge United
Danny Loader, left 2020, now at Porto (2 goals in 21 league apps)
Andrija Novakovich, left 2020, now a sometime US international with Venezia in Italy
Ben House, left 2020, now averaging 1 goal in 4 games at Lincoln City
Thierry Nevers, left 2021, now on loan at Bradford City from West Ham

YorkshireRoyal99
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 5005
Joined: 10 Aug 2017 18:07

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 24 Mar 2023 09:49

A pretty mixed bag then but you could comfortably make a competitive Championship side with those players there alone. Might be lacking some firepower but it would be solid enough overall at minimum.

SCIAG
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 6362
Joined: 17 Jun 2008 17:43
Location: Liburd for England

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by SCIAG » 24 Mar 2023 19:24

Southwood
Dickie, Cooper, Hyam
Stacey, Rinomhota, Holsgrove, Richards
Olise, Loader, Fosu

Gone with Holsgrove ahead of Kelly even though Kelly is more proven simply because he's playing at a higher level now.

Could use a real goalscorer but would be very defensively solid and should create chances. Cooper might end up as top scorer, or even playing centre forward.

Clyde1998
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 1596
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 16:27

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Clyde1998 » 25 Mar 2023 02:11

Sutekh Just thought I’d list the academy prospects that the club have had between 2015-16 and 2019-20 and where they are now. There is a handful missing as I can’t find out info on them and I’ve omitted those that are still playing at Reading that aren’t on loan.

Keepers
Stuart Moore, left 2017, now on loan at Doncaster from Blackpool
Lewis Ward, left 2019, now without a club after being released by Sutton United in January 2023
George Legg, left 2019, now without a club after leaving Thatcham Town in 2021
Luke Southwood, now on loan at Cheltenham
James Holden, left 2022, now on loan at Dulwich Hamlet from Cambridge United

Defenders
Pierce Sweeney, left 2016, now an Exeter City stalwart of some 200 games (signed for Swindon last year and stayed 1 day before returning to Exeter)
Sean Long, left 2017, now at Cheltenham Town
Niall Keown, left 2017, believed retired due to injury in 2019
Jake Cooper, left 2017, now Millwall stalwart with around 250 league appearances
Tennai Watson, left 2021, now with Franchise FC
Dominic Hyam, left 2017, now with Blackburn and called up to the latest Scotland squad
Rob Dickie, left 2018, now with QPR
Zak Jules, left 2017, now with Franchise FC
Axel Andrésson, left 2018, now an Icelandic international at Orebro in Denmark
Gabriel Osho, left 2020, now at Luton
Omar Richards, left 2021, now still awaiting his Nottm Forest debut after joining them in 2022
Teddy Howe, left 2020, now with Weymouth
Jeriel Dorset, now on loan at Kilmarnock

Midfielders
Aaron Tshibola, left 2016, now at AEL Limassol
Aaron Kuhl, left 2017, now at Dorking Wanderers
Jack Stacey, left 2017, now a right back at Bournemouth (9 PL apps this season)
Liam Kelly, left 2019, now at Rochdale
Tariq Fosu, left 2017, now on loan at Rotherham from Brentford
Josh Barrett, left 2020, now at King’s Lynn Town
Connor Shaughnessy, left 2016, now at Burton Albion
Samúel Kári Friðjónsson, left 2016, now an Icelandic international at Atrimitos in the Greek Super League
Noor Husin, left 2016, now at Southend United
Lisandro Semedo, left 2016, now a Cape Verde international with Radomiak Radom in Poland
Andy Rinomhota, left 2022, now with Cardiff
Ryan East, left 2021, now at Bradford City
Tyler Frost, left 2020, now at Aldershot Town
Jordan Holsgrove, left 2020, now with Pacos de Ferreira in Portugal
Joel Rollinson, left 2019, now with Hungerford Town
Jokull Andresson, now on loan at Stevenage
Michael Olise, left 2021, now at Crystal Palace (61 apps, 6 goals)

Forwards
Craig Tanner, left 2019, now at Ebbsfleet United
Dominic Samuel, left 2018, now at Ross County
Harry Cardwell, left 2017, now at Southend United
Sam Smith, left 2021, now averaging around 1 goal in 4 games at Cambridge United
Danny Loader, left 2020, now at Porto (2 goals in 21 league apps)
Andrija Novakovich, left 2020, now a sometime US international with Venezia in Italy
Ben House, left 2020, now averaging 1 goal in 4 games at Lincoln City
Thierry Nevers, left 2021, now on loan at Bradford City from West Ham

I wouldn't call Obita or HRK academy prospects between that period, as they were firmly established as first team players, so I've removed them.

I guess the question is what's a reasonable amout of Championship-level (or better) players we should expect from our academy?

I've put the players I think would be in the matchday squad for us (or a higher level) in blue, the players who I think are around League One level in orange. Some of these players still have time to improve and could jump a category as a result.

I make that twelve at our level or higher, eighteen at League One level and eleven at a lower level (Niall Keown seemingly retired due to injury, so discounted). I don't think that's a bad return tbh.

If we had the highlighted players as a squad to stay in the Championship, I think we'd have a decent chance of staying in the division. I'd be concerned about goals, the goalkeepers and squad depth, but for a squad that would've entirely come through the academy there can't be too many clubs at our level who'd have a better side (especially when discounting one-off players like Jude Bellingham at Birmingham).


User avatar
Sutekh
Hob Nob Super-Addict
Posts: 18383
Joined: 12 Feb 2014 14:05
Location: Undiscovered pyramid somewhere in Egypt

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Sutekh » 26 Mar 2023 08:59

Kian Leavy called up to the RoI U21 squad.

Royals and Racers
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 4740
Joined: 05 Jan 2012 16:48

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Royals and Racers » 26 Mar 2023 19:59

U 18`s beat Crewe 4-0 at Bearwood on Saturday. Royals up to 4th in South table with just 6 to play.

Royals and Racers
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 4740
Joined: 05 Jan 2012 16:48

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Royals and Racers » 28 Mar 2023 10:01

Pretty decent article on the progress of the U 18`s in March- has someone finally listened to my criticism :) The only thing they didn`t mention( which i did on here ) is the Standing of Barnsley in the Northern section !!
https://www.readingfc.co.uk/news/2023/m ... arch-2023/
Last edited by Royals and Racers on 28 Mar 2023 10:11, edited 1 time in total.

Royals and Racers
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 4740
Joined: 05 Jan 2012 16:48

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Royals and Racers » 28 Mar 2023 10:10

Next up for the U 21`s is a home PDL South match at Bearwood on Friday afternoon 31st March against the fake hoops QPR KO 2pm.
It remains to be seen if RFC inform season ticket holders that they can attend by splashing out £5 for the privilege !! One has to phone the ticket office 01189 681313 to purchase.
Last edited by Royals and Racers on 28 Mar 2023 18:42, edited 1 time in total.


South Coast Royal
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 5640
Joined: 16 Jan 2020 17:29

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by South Coast Royal » 28 Mar 2023 10:25

Clyde1998
Sutekh Just thought I’d list the academy prospects that the club have had between 2015-16 and 2019-20 and where they are now. There is a handful missing as I can’t find out info on them and I’ve omitted those that are still playing at Reading that aren’t on loan.

Keepers
Stuart Moore, left 2017, now on loan at Doncaster from Blackpool
Lewis Ward, left 2019, now without a club after being released by Sutton United in January 2023
George Legg, left 2019, now without a club after leaving Thatcham Town in 2021
Luke Southwood, now on loan at Cheltenham
James Holden, left 2022, now on loan at Dulwich Hamlet from Cambridge United

Defenders
Pierce Sweeney, left 2016, now an Exeter City stalwart of some 200 games (signed for Swindon last year and stayed 1 day before returning to Exeter)
Sean Long, left 2017, now at Cheltenham Town
Niall Keown, left 2017, believed retired due to injury in 2019
Jake Cooper, left 2017, now Millwall stalwart with around 250 league appearances
Tennai Watson, left 2021, now with Franchise FC
Dominic Hyam, left 2017, now with Blackburn and called up to the latest Scotland squad
Rob Dickie, left 2018, now with QPR
Zak Jules, left 2017, now with Franchise FC
Axel Andrésson, left 2018, now an Icelandic international at Orebro in Denmark
Gabriel Osho, left 2020, now at Luton
Omar Richards, left 2021, now still awaiting his Nottm Forest debut after joining them in 2022
Teddy Howe, left 2020, now with Weymouth
Jeriel Dorset, now on loan at Kilmarnock

Midfielders
Aaron Tshibola, left 2016, now at AEL Limassol
Aaron Kuhl, left 2017, now at Dorking Wanderers
Jack Stacey, left 2017, now a right back at Bournemouth (9 PL apps this season)
Liam Kelly, left 2019, now at Rochdale
Tariq Fosu, left 2017, now on loan at Rotherham from Brentford
Josh Barrett, left 2020, now at King’s Lynn Town
Connor Shaughnessy, left 2016, now at Burton Albion
Samúel Kári Friðjónsson, left 2016, now an Icelandic international at Atrimitos in the Greek Super League
Noor Husin, left 2016, now at Southend United
Lisandro Semedo, left 2016, now a Cape Verde international with Radomiak Radom in Poland
Andy Rinomhota, left 2022, now with Cardiff
Ryan East, left 2021, now at Bradford City
Tyler Frost, left 2020, now at Aldershot Town
Jordan Holsgrove, left 2020, now with Pacos de Ferreira in Portugal
Joel Rollinson, left 2019, now with Hungerford Town
Jokull Andresson, now on loan at Stevenage
Michael Olise, left 2021, now at Crystal Palace (61 apps, 6 goals)

Forwards
Craig Tanner, left 2019, now at Ebbsfleet United
Dominic Samuel, left 2018, now at Ross County
Harry Cardwell, left 2017, now at Southend United
Sam Smith, left 2021, now averaging around 1 goal in 4 games at Cambridge United
Danny Loader, left 2020, now at Porto (2 goals in 21 league apps)
Andrija Novakovich, left 2020, now a sometime US international with Venezia in Italy
Ben House, left 2020, now averaging 1 goal in 4 games at Lincoln City
Thierry Nevers, left 2021, now on loan at Bradford City from West Ham

I wouldn't call Obita or HRK academy prospects between that period, as they were firmly established as first team players, so I've removed them.

I guess the question is what's a reasonable amout of Championship-level (or better) players we should expect from our academy?

I've put the players I think would be in the matchday squad for us (or a higher level) in blue, the players who I think are around League One level in orange. Some of these players still have time to improve and could jump a category as a result.

I make that twelve at our level or higher, eighteen at League One level and eleven at a lower level (Niall Keown seemingly retired due to injury, so discounted). I don't think that's a bad return tbh.

If we had the highlighted players as a squad to stay in the Championship, I think we'd have a decent chance of staying in the division. I'd be concerned about goals, the goalkeepers and squad depth, but for a squad that would've entirely come through the academy there can't be too many clubs at our level who'd have a better side (especially when discounting one-off players like Jude Bellingham at Birmingham).


Good work by Sutekh.
I guess that we have produced quite a few who are around Champ/Div 1 level but the disappointment would be that over 7 or 8 years we have only produced the one real Premier League player in Michael Olise who of course had his early grounding with Chelsea and Man City.

For all the investment I don't know whether the Academy has been a great success or has just produced the number and levels that we might expect.
Over the same period Brentford has used a model of picking up players from other Academies ( as well as buying players well of course) rather than go to the considerable expense of running their own set-up of Academy and Reserve team football.
Currently theirs is a success story but whether it will continue to be is anybody's guess.

I suppose the disappointment with our Academy is that we have picked up so little in transfer fees from the players that have moved on-maybe that is just symbolic of our club that is not very good when it comes to money. :wink:
Also with strikers being the most valuable and difficult to find, our success rate has been less than for example in producing centre-backs, i.e. those quoted plus Holmes and McIntyre from the current squad.

Hound
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 24934
Joined: 27 Sep 2016 22:16
Location: Simpleton

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hound » 28 Mar 2023 10:38

Re strikers - guess still time for Loader; seems to be at least in the discussion for the first team at Porto

Do like the look of Ehibhatiomhan. Probably more interested in him than any other striker in the last 6-7 years other than Loader

Guess it’s always easy to compare to Brentford - but they are the exception. Just a very well run club. I suspect if they had a cat 1 category they’d have made a success of that as well

Royals and Racers
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 4740
Joined: 05 Jan 2012 16:48

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Royals and Racers » 30 Mar 2023 17:00

Royals and Racers Next up for the U 21`s is a home PDL South match at Bearwood on Friday afternoon 31st March against the fake hoops QPR KO 2pm.
It remains to be seen if RFC inform season ticket holders that they can attend by splashing out £5 for the privilege !! One has to phone the ticket office 01189 681313 to purchase.

Just been emailed by the club that the match now has a 1.30pm KO time

User avatar
Brogue
Hob Nob Super-Addict
Posts: 10509
Joined: 02 Mar 2021 20:38

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Brogue » 31 Mar 2023 12:05

Princewill Ehibhatiomhan signs for Southampton

User avatar
tidus_mi2
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 7277
Joined: 15 Jun 2012 15:24

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by tidus_mi2 » 31 Mar 2023 12:42

Brogue Princewill Ehibhatiomhan signs for Southampton

What does that mean for us? I assume we hadn't agreed a professional contract with him by the looks of the wording on the deal so is it just compensation as per the EPPP rules?

Royals and Racers
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 4740
Joined: 05 Jan 2012 16:48

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Royals and Racers » 31 Mar 2023 13:05

Boyce-Clarke
Abdel-Salam
Paul
Craig
Holzman
Maragh
Akande
Bloxham
Greaver
Scott
Camara
SUBS
Borgnis
Norcott-Gk
Vickers
Purcell
Okine-Peters

User avatar
morganb
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 2422
Joined: 31 Jul 2017 12:30

Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by morganb » 31 Mar 2023 13:12

Royals and Racers Boyce-Clarke
Abdel-Salam
Paul
Craig
Holzman
Maragh
Akande
Bloxham
Greaver
Scott
Camara
SUBS
Borgnis
Norcott-Gk
Vickers
Purcell
Okine-Peters


Maragh was previously listed as trialist, has he now signed for us?

7490 posts

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bcubed, Linden Jones' Tash, Royals and Racers and 387 guests

It is currently 28 Mar 2024 08:34