The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hound » 24 May 2021 15:05

think we're seeing the real impact of the Gourlay overspend era now.

it isnt so much the inability to sign players or possible points deductions as not being able to offer bright young talents proper contracts. Lost Richards, could well lose Olise on the cheap as he won't extend, TMc, Nevers etc

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by tidus_mi2 » 24 May 2021 15:19

Hendo
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Straight into the first team?


Do we get any comp?

We offered a contract so we should get compensation.


I think that only applies if they go abroad, isn't it?

Not surprised he turned us down for West Ham, we could've offered him a decent contract and he still would've turned it down.

Although I don't know whether he'll break into the first team, and I would have a sneaking suspicion that he'll end up in league 1 in 2-3 years time.

No, England have compensation rules, they still aren't great but we'll get something.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015

by Zip » 24 May 2021 15:45

Hound think we're seeing the real impact of the Gourlay overspend era now.

it isnt so much the inability to sign players or possible points deductions as not being able to offer bright young talents proper contracts. Lost Richards, could well lose Olise on the cheap as he won't extend, TMc, Nevers etc


Yep. It does seem the contracts we are offering our brightest young talents are simply not competitive. We have lost Nevers appear to have lost Richards and may well lose TMac with no tangible transfer income to show for it.
Very disheartening.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by tidus_mi2 » 24 May 2021 15:53

I get that we've taken the piss a lot but surely the EFL can show a bit of flexibility, offering a youngster who has shown he can cut it in the 1st team something like £10k on the condition we'll accept good offers and look to move on high earners.

Just completing cutting us off just screws us completely.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by SpaghettiHoop » 24 May 2021 16:56

It shows how unfit for purpose the FFP rules are. They prevent new investment in the sport.


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Sutekh » 24 May 2021 17:42

SpaghettiHoop It shows how unfit for purpose the FFP rules are. They prevent new investment in the sport.


Agree, FFP is just there to maintain the status quo so that all the smaller clubs stay smaller. The whole system should be taken down and scrapped.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Simon's Church » 24 May 2021 19:23

Hound think we're seeing the real impact of the Gourlay overspend era now.

it isnt so much the inability to sign players or possible points deductions as not being able to offer bright young talents proper contracts. Lost Richards, could well lose Olise on the cheap as he won't extend, TMc, Nevers etc


And the the overspend in the post gourlay too

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Ascotexgunner » 24 May 2021 21:22

Christ it really is depressing reading Get Reading. We won't have any players come the start of the season, all our youngsters have left on a free, and throw Rafael and his futures in doubt headlines and we are seriously screwed next season.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by tidus_mi2 » 24 May 2021 21:47

I feel like Nevers is gearing up to announce his signing for West Ham, he's just tweeted his Insta account, wonder if he's been told he needs to have a presence on Insta.


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Royals and Racers » 25 May 2021 07:20

Royals and Racers
Royals and Racers Play-off semi`s are
Stoke v Sunderland
Crystal Palace v Wolves
only 1 game
Leeds and the play-off winner go up to Div 1 and Southampton and Leicester will play in div 2 next season.

Final is Palace v Sunderland

Palace won on Pens- Interesting that the 2 new Cat 1 academies in their 1st season in PL 2 got promoted. Burnley were the other new Cat 1 in the division and they didn’t do to badly.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Elm Park Kid » 25 May 2021 09:44

We don't know the true situation with FFP to be fair, or what we've been offering players.

There's no way in general that we can compete salary-wise if a club like West Ham wants one of our youngsters. They can easily just pay someone £10k a week and not worry if they never trouble the first team. We simply can't do that, regardless of any overspending in the past. It's why with players like these that you need to get them in your first team as fast as possible - there's only a small window you have where a decent youngster is going to value first team football and the Championship wages he'll get over PL opportunities.

The situation with Richards is a little different as German football isn't as crazy as the PL. But Bayern are still paying an average first team salary of £100k a week. If they can offer Richards 30k a week then there's not much we can or should be doing to counter that.

When similar sized Championship teams start taking players of us that's when we need to worry.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Mid Sussex Royal » 25 May 2021 10:05

The official club site says we activated an extension clause for Nevers similar to Morro so we will get a proper fee.

If that's the case its probably good business to get a fee now as I can only see him being involved in the cups this season.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hendo » 25 May 2021 10:50

It is obviously huge news, seeing as Neves is trending on Twitter!*

*It is 100% not about Ruben Neves potentially leaving Wolves


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015

by Snowflake Royal » 25 May 2021 12:05

Zip
Hound think we're seeing the real impact of the Gourlay overspend era now.

it isnt so much the inability to sign players or possible points deductions as not being able to offer bright young talents proper contracts. Lost Richards, could well lose Olise on the cheap as he won't extend, TMc, Nevers etc


Yep. It does seem the contracts we are offering our brightest young talents are simply not competitive. We have lost Nevers appear to have lost Richards and may well lose TMac with no tangible transfer income to show for it.
Very disheartening.

Let's be realistic though...

Gourlay or no Gourlay, we're never competing with Bayern or West Ham on a money or attractiveness level.

If McIntyre ends up somewhere like Cardiff, yeah we're obviously really in the shit. But Nevers has had injury issues iirc and hasn't had an appearance, whilst Richards only really blossomed this season and signed with Bayern in Jan. So like a six month window missed is all.

I wouldn't worry too much based on these two.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 25 May 2021 12:10

Sutekh
SpaghettiHoop It shows how unfit for purpose the FFP rules are. They prevent new investment in the sport.


Agree, FFP is just there to maintain the status quo so that all the smaller clubs stay smaller. The whole system should be taken down and scrapped.

It's not investment. It's financial doping.

FFP allows clubs to inject vast amounts of money beyond their income continually. We've just done vastly more than allowed.

It's to stop clubs going into financial armageddon

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015

by Hound » 25 May 2021 13:53

Snowflake Royal
Zip
Hound think we're seeing the real impact of the Gourlay overspend era now.

it isnt so much the inability to sign players or possible points deductions as not being able to offer bright young talents proper contracts. Lost Richards, could well lose Olise on the cheap as he won't extend, TMc, Nevers etc


Yep. It does seem the contracts we are offering our brightest young talents are simply not competitive. We have lost Nevers appear to have lost Richards and may well lose TMac with no tangible transfer income to show for it.
Very disheartening.

Let's be realistic though...

Gourlay or no Gourlay, we're never competing with Bayern or West Ham on a money or attractiveness level.

If McIntyre ends up somewhere like Cardiff, yeah we're obviously really in the shit. But Nevers has had injury issues iirc and hasn't had an appearance, whilst Richards only really blossomed this season and signed with Bayern in Jan. So like a six month window missed is all.

I wouldn't worry too much based on these two.


guessing Richards would have been offered a decent contract well before Bayern starting sniffing had we been able to. At least I hope so. Same with Tmc, sorted well before he even came close to being ooc

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015

by Snowflake Royal » 25 May 2021 14:47

Hound
Snowflake Royal
Zip
Yep. It does seem the contracts we are offering our brightest young talents are simply not competitive. We have lost Nevers appear to have lost Richards and may well lose TMac with no tangible transfer income to show for it.
Very disheartening.

Let's be realistic though...

Gourlay or no Gourlay, we're never competing with Bayern or West Ham on a money or attractiveness level.

If McIntyre ends up somewhere like Cardiff, yeah we're obviously really in the shit. But Nevers has had injury issues iirc and hasn't had an appearance, whilst Richards only really blossomed this season and signed with Bayern in Jan. So like a six month window missed is all.

I wouldn't worry too much based on these two.


guessing Richards would have been offered a decent contract well before Bayern starting sniffing had we been able to. At least I hope so. Same with Tmc, sorted well before he even came close to being ooc

Richards, not so sure about that.

He ended up LB by default when Obita and Blackett left and wasn't substantially better than either at the time. Remember we offered Blackett a contract which he turned down... not sure on Obita

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Elm Park Kid » 25 May 2021 15:22

Snowflake Royal
Sutekh
SpaghettiHoop It shows how unfit for purpose the FFP rules are. They prevent new investment in the sport.


Agree, FFP is just there to maintain the status quo so that all the smaller clubs stay smaller. The whole system should be taken down and scrapped.

It's not investment. It's financial doping.

FFP allows clubs to inject vast amounts of money beyond their income continually. We've just done vastly more than allowed.

It's to stop clubs going into financial armageddon


I agree.

I understand why people can look at this situation and ask how it is that FFP doesn't allow the owners to fund even the wages of the players we have, let alone the ones we might need to compete in the league. But the reality is that wages have only gotten to this level due to the impact of rich 'investors'. If we're allowed to pump in more money, that means everyone else is as well and we'll just get to a point where wages are pushed up even more.

How would it feel to be a fan of a club that are trying to do things 'properly'? Spending only what you're raising in income; investing in the youth squad, working hard with scouts to find cheaper talent in the lower leagues and trusting your manager to eventually get the best out of all of them. You do that for 2-3 years and start doing well - then clubs like Reading comes along splashing millions of pounds around and picking off your squad one by one. It's like that Mitchell and Webb sketch where you have to start asking . . . . Are we the baddies?

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by tidus_mi2 » 25 May 2021 15:40

Elm Park Kid
Snowflake Royal
Sutekh
Agree, FFP is just there to maintain the status quo so that all the smaller clubs stay smaller. The whole system should be taken down and scrapped.

It's not investment. It's financial doping.

FFP allows clubs to inject vast amounts of money beyond their income continually. We've just done vastly more than allowed.

It's to stop clubs going into financial armageddon


I agree.

I understand why people can look at this situation and ask how it is that FFP doesn't allow the owners to fund even the wages of the players we have, let alone the ones we might need to compete in the league. But the reality is that wages have only gotten to this level due to the impact of rich 'investors'. If we're allowed to pump in more money, that means everyone else is as well and we'll just get to a point where wages are pushed up even more.

How would it feel to be a fan of a club that are trying to do things 'properly'? Spending only what you're raising in income; investing in the youth squad, working hard with scouts to find cheaper talent in the lower leagues and trusting your manager to eventually get the best out of all of them. You do that for 2-3 years and start doing well - then clubs like Reading comes along splashing millions of pounds around and picking off your squad one by one. It's like that Mitchell and Webb sketch where you have to start asking . . . . Are we the baddies?

I feel like we're basically QPR of a few seasons ago, tried to overspend to get in the Prem and now trying to reign it back now that it has failed. I agree with the principal of FFP but it is at times too inflexible which contributes to this overarching view that it favours the big teams.

The number 1 issue that has caused the financial situation in the Championship is the grossly uneven distribution of money across the leagues, it affects even those not chasing the Premier League honeypot because every time there is a wage hike in the Prem, it trickles down to the Championship but incomes don't rise at the same rate.

Then you have parachute payments where they once served the purpose to stop relegated teams imploding, they now just give them a bigger financial cushion to outspend their divisional rivals.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Elm Park Kid » 26 May 2021 14:31

tidus_mi2
Elm Park Kid
Snowflake Royal It's not investment. It's financial doping.

FFP allows clubs to inject vast amounts of money beyond their income continually. We've just done vastly more than allowed.

It's to stop clubs going into financial armageddon


I agree.

I understand why people can look at this situation and ask how it is that FFP doesn't allow the owners to fund even the wages of the players we have, let alone the ones we might need to compete in the league. But the reality is that wages have only gotten to this level due to the impact of rich 'investors'. If we're allowed to pump in more money, that means everyone else is as well and we'll just get to a point where wages are pushed up even more.

How would it feel to be a fan of a club that are trying to do things 'properly'? Spending only what you're raising in income; investing in the youth squad, working hard with scouts to find cheaper talent in the lower leagues and trusting your manager to eventually get the best out of all of them. You do that for 2-3 years and start doing well - then clubs like Reading comes along splashing millions of pounds around and picking off your squad one by one. It's like that Mitchell and Webb sketch where you have to start asking . . . . Are we the baddies?

I feel like we're basically QPR of a few seasons ago, tried to overspend to get in the Prem and now trying to reign it back now that it has failed. I agree with the principal of FFP but it is at times too inflexible which contributes to this overarching view that it favours the big teams.

The number 1 issue that has caused the financial situation in the Championship is the grossly uneven distribution of money across the leagues, it affects even those not chasing the Premier League honeypot because every time there is a wage hike in the Prem, it trickles down to the Championship but incomes don't rise at the same rate.

Then you have parachute payments where they once served the purpose to stop relegated teams imploding, they now just give them a bigger financial cushion to outspend their divisional rivals.


Personally I don't have a big problem with the 'big' clubs having a natural advantage. Clubs with more fans and higher income should be able to outspend the rest, it's the reward for growing your club and attracting fans over decades. But that sort of financial advantage doesn't guarantee success, there is still enough randomness in the game to make it competitive. It's only when you can outspend your rivals multiple times due to outside 'investment' that it becomes an issue in our league - something that FFP is suppose to stop but doesn't.

The parachute payment system is fundamentally flawed. There obviously has to be something to stop clubs being bankrupted by trying to pay PL wages on Championship income. But that could be resolved through mandatory relegation clauses and compensation payments direct to the affected players - rather than giving clubs millions to spend as they see fit.

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