The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

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Snowflake Royal
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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Snowflake Royal » 15 Jul 2022 08:20

royalp-we
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royalp-we How long have we had Cat 1 status, 10 years? If it costs £5m pa to apply for Cat 1 status, Have we seen a positive ROI from it?
.

Iirc it was about £2m a few years ago. And yes, we've easily seen a return on investment. £8m + goals and assists from Olise. Fees / compensation for some of Richards, Stacey, Hyam, Dickie, Fosu etc.

Many appearances from Holmes, McIntyre, Richards, Rinomhota, Hector, Cooper, Taylor, Southwood and many others.

It's the one part of the club that consistently delivers, and the cost can be largely excluded from financial fair play.


I’m fairly confident it’s closer to £5m Ian.

Most of the players you have listed left for nothing and had no impact on our first team whatsoever. Did we really get much in return from developing Taylor, Dickie, Hyam, Fosu, Stacey etc?

I wouldn’t say there’s ‘easily’ been a return on investment at all and there’s clearly a reason why they aren’t choosing to reapply this year.

Like I said, at least they haven’t scrapped it altogether.

Edit: a quick google search throws up it was £2.4-£4.8m in 2012 and some clubs claiming it’s now costing £8m-£10m per year for elite Cat 1 status. I guess thats one of the reasons why only 4/5/6 clubs outside the top flight go for it each season?

So I was right about the ~£2m. As Nameless said it's running costs, not a permit fee.

And if you only count transfer fees against the cost you're ignoring the vast majority of the benefit.

Every appearance by an academy player is one a signing would have to make without the academy. Signings tend to start on higher wages and often cost a fee.

The Academy is one of the few parts of the club thats easily cost effective. And it can largely be funded direct from the owner's pocket.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hound » 15 Jul 2022 08:25

Considering the investment in Bearwood etc, no doubts the academy isn’t actually going anywhere. Plenty of good u23 players just signed up to new deals

Be nice if a proper explanation is given. Maybe it’s something Bowen has recommended, but does seem strange

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by NewCorkSeth » 15 Jul 2022 08:54

I thought our academy had done pretty well in recent years, just hasn't been used enough to supplement the first team. Wasn't the Ajax model that every year there should be at least 1 academy player promoted to the first team? We're not far off doing that.

I think we just need to get better at selling from our academy. Accept our status as bottom feeders.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Nameless » 15 Jul 2022 08:55

Hound Considering the investment in Bearwood etc, no doubts the academy isn’t actually going anywhere. Plenty of good u23 players just signed up to new deals

Be nice if a proper explanation is given. Maybe it’s something Bowen has recommended, but does seem strange


If we aren’t cat 1 (and there seems no evidence yet we aren’t) then we’ll struggle to recruit good youngsters and any we do recruit will be poached.
If we have lost status after an audit that is shocking and almost impossible to understand
If we have given it up there needs to be a clear explanation of the logic behind it.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by WestYorksRoyal » 15 Jul 2022 09:23

Isn't academy spending excluded from FFP? If so, Dai should go all out to get Cat 1 back, if he's as committed as Bowen says. The implications are real. Smaller pool of players we can recruit from, PL clubs in the South may poach our best prospects, kicked out of the top academy leagues. We'd notice the impact upon our first team within 5 years or so.


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Stranded » 15 Jul 2022 09:30

We would, if we aren't careful about it. More clubs moving towards a B team model, might be the way forward.

Football is cyclical, so we may actually start to see a shift back towards reserve team leagues but under the guise of B teams.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 15 Jul 2022 09:40

It does all seem a bit strange, unless the running costs of being a Category One academy was too much for the club, but I don't see why that would be a problem considering the money we've spent on all activities at the club in the last 5 years. It's definitely disappointing considering we are prolific are churning out really good talents that make a career for themselves at this level as well. It should be where we try and drive our players to come through.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by NewCorkSeth » 15 Jul 2022 10:05


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by RG30 » 15 Jul 2022 10:37

SCIAG
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morganb

That Tweet in full:

https://mobile.twitter.com/HenryKnight_ ... 1877486592



Looks pretty official, especially if Henry Knight has broken the story.


Hope you haven't been duped in by someone with 73 followers... :?

I suspect Morgan was using more than his fair share of irony. RG30 has been taken in though.


I look forward to your retraction :wink: .

I don’t follow the academy scene as much as others on this thread but what a disaster for the club having waited so long for Bearwood.


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Zip » 15 Jul 2022 10:48

Hugely disappointing news. It will make it so much harder to bring in bright talented youngsters to the club.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Nameless » 15 Jul 2022 10:55

RG30
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Hope you haven't been duped in by someone with 73 followers... :?

I suspect Morgan was using more than his fair share of irony. RG30 has been taken in though.


I look forward to your retraction :wink: .

I don’t follow the academy scene as much as others on this thread but what a disaster for the club having waited so long for Bearwood.


Seems very strange for a long standing Academy to be downgraded with no apparent warning (Burnley had a year to sort out issues). Suspect the new appointments have been designed to resolve what ever the issue is and we’ll be reinstated, but probably not until next season.
Bearwood is not just about the Academy of course.....

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by NewCorkSeth » 15 Jul 2022 10:59

Nameless
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SCIAG I suspect Morgan was using more than his fair share of irony. RG30 has been taken in though.


I look forward to your retraction :wink: .

I don’t follow the academy scene as much as others on this thread but what a disaster for the club having waited so long for Bearwood.


Seems very strange for a long standing Academy to be downgraded with no apparent warning (Burnley had a year to sort out issues). Suspect the new appointments have been designed to resolve what ever the issue is and we’ll be reinstated, but probably not until next season.
Bearwood is not just about the Academy of course.....

Maybe the club did get a warning? It was in the spam folder of Paunos email..

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Nameless » 15 Jul 2022 11:48

NewCorkSeth
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RG30
I look forward to your retraction :wink: .

I don’t follow the academy scene as much as others on this thread but what a disaster for the club having waited so long for Bearwood.


Seems very strange for a long standing Academy to be downgraded with no apparent warning (Burnley had a year to sort out issues). Suspect the new appointments have been designed to resolve what ever the issue is and we’ll be reinstated, but probably not until next season.
Bearwood is not just about the Academy of course.....

Maybe the club did get a warning? It was in the spam folder of Paunos email..


Unlikely as he had nothing to do with the Academy....
The Burnley and Birmingham situations didn’t just come out of the blue, if we had been on a warning it would surely have been known about ?


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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by RG30 » 15 Jul 2022 11:52

Via Training Ground Guru tweets;

Reading's Academy has faced a lot of problems which have been outside their control: understaffing, under-resourcing & facilities not fully open.

Insiders say situation has improved since Mark Bowen's arrival as Director of Football Ops. Now a bridge between Board & Academy.

Club say there won't be any job losses at the Academy as a result of the demotion... and that they'll reapply for Cat 1 at earliest opportunity.

Reading told staff/ players/ parents that club had been demoted to Cat 2 yesterday. Even some senior staff hadn’t known before that. Some parents unhappy as player inductions have already taken place.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Zip » 15 Jul 2022 11:59

RG30’s post sadly illustrates just how badly run we had become. Good that Bowen has now started to turn things around. Just such a shame we ended up becoming such a mess of a football club. Hopefully we will now move in the right direction but this is a real blow to the Academy.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Hound » 15 Jul 2022 12:01

Yep scary but unsurprising

Bowen is having to be a very busy man. Should never have stopped being DoF in the first place; we’d be a hell of a lot better off I’m sure

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by YorkshireRoyal99 » 15 Jul 2022 12:38

Massive shame for the club, hopefully we get our Category One academy status back as soon as possible.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by paultheroyal » 15 Jul 2022 12:49

No surprise at all really but i think its just a case of timing than anything else to be worried about.

Auditors etc visited at a time when it was an utter mess. From own experience this has been a long time coming and before the move to Bearwood. Its only in the last few weeks they are getting their act together but its way to late for when final assessment is completed.

Poorer sub standard teams for our academy lads to play next season and a slight detriment to the younger ages as well. However, this would not, in my opinion stop up and coming football stars aged 11-15 to not want to join Reading FC. Category status would not be a factor ultimately to not want to join an academy.

I expect, in one year's time for all this to be sorted and Category 1 status to be returned to the club.

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by 72 bus » 15 Jul 2022 13:51

paultheroyal No surprise at all really but i think its just a case of timing than anything else to be worried about.

Auditors etc visited at a time when it was an utter mess. From own experience this has been a long time coming and before the move to Bearwood. Its only in the last few weeks they are getting their act together but its way to late for when final assessment is completed.

Poorer sub standard teams for our academy lads to play next season and a slight detriment to the younger ages as well. However, this would not, in my opinion stop up and coming football stars aged 11-15 to not want to join Reading FC. Category status would not be a factor ultimately to not want to join an academy.

I expect, in one year's time for all this to be sorted and Category 1 status to be returned to the club.


But it makes it easier for cat one clubs to cherry pick our youngsters

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Re: The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2015//16

by Stranded » 15 Jul 2022 14:17

72 bus
paultheroyal No surprise at all really but i think its just a case of timing than anything else to be worried about.

Auditors etc visited at a time when it was an utter mess. From own experience this has been a long time coming and before the move to Bearwood. Its only in the last few weeks they are getting their act together but its way to late for when final assessment is completed.

Poorer sub standard teams for our academy lads to play next season and a slight detriment to the younger ages as well. However, this would not, in my opinion stop up and coming football stars aged 11-15 to not want to join Reading FC. Category status would not be a factor ultimately to not want to join an academy.

I expect, in one year's time for all this to be sorted and Category 1 status to be returned to the club.


But it makes it easier for cat one clubs to cherry pick our youngsters


Realistically there was very little to stop a PL club signing who they wanted anyway and only until they have signed a pro deal.

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