Record Watch 2016-17

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Silver Fox
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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Silver Fox » 04 Nov 2016 09:56

tidus_mi2 I would point out something though, are we shit or do you classify our style of football as unattractive? Because it is currently getting the results to have us 5th in the league, if it's not pretty, it certainly is effective. As for the overall strength of the league, the only thing you can do is compare who we lost to who we gained.

Burnely, Middlesbrough and Hull promoted to Premier League
Charlton, MK Dons and Bolton relegated to League One

Newcastle, Norwich, Villa relegated to Championship
Wigan, Barnsley, Burton promoted to Championship

I look at those team change overs and I would argue the league is actually stronger this season.


Pretty much agreed with all of this

"We're fifth so the league must be shit" might be the stupidest opinion on here for some time

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Silver Fox » 04 Nov 2016 09:57

Ian Royal We're definitely not shit. We have some substantial weaknesses, but we're very far from shit. We also are rather unlikely to stay in the top six, and talking about us being 5th is rather disingenuous as we're only there on the back of the last result, having been in 8th for 5 of the last 8 results.


Wrong, we're fifth based on all our results this season, compared to everyone elses

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Saaaaaaaammmmmm » 04 Nov 2016 11:08

I would argue we are 5th because the league is strong

Strength in depth means more teams are taking points off each other, creating a more balanced, competitive league

The Top 5 in the Premier League so far this season have lost a total of 5 games between them, and only one of those (Liverpool vs Burnley) was from a side outside the Top 5

Compare that to the Championship, the Top 5 in our division have lost 18 games already. Last weekend Fulham (14th at the time) thrashed Huddersfield (3rd) 5-0, showing that even the lower-ranked clubs are capable of comfortably beating the top teams

Two ways of interpreting that. Either the Championship is incredibly competitive as always, or we are all just as bad as each other

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by SCIAG » 04 Nov 2016 13:33

Maneki Neko
Add in to that the record spending by Championship clubs this summer and the increasing quality of the league standards and I think its fair to say the league is much stronger than it was.


increased spending doesn't mean increased quality
its pretty much the same pool of players to choose from, theyre just paying more for them

Nah. The Championship's better placed to attract players from abroad thanks to the money trickling down from the PL.

In 05/06 we had eight foreigners of whom three were Irish. This year we have 13 in the first team squad (plus Hurtado) including two Irishmen. Newcastle have 15 including three Irishmen. I'm sure it's a significant increase across the board.

The increased number of foreigners in the PL probably also means we have better Brits in the Championship.

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Ian Royal » 04 Nov 2016 13:53

Silver Fox
Ian Royal We're definitely not shit. We have some substantial weaknesses, but we're very far from shit. We also are rather unlikely to stay in the top six, and talking about us being 5th is rather disingenuous as we're only there on the back of the last result, having been in 8th for 5 of the last 8 results.


Wrong, we're fifth based on all our results this season, compared to everyone elses

It's a snap shot. Take it any other time we're not. If we can sustain it over the next few games that's a different matter. Lose the next game and drop down to 8th again and the argument immediately evaporates.

It's not complicated.


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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Maneki Neko » 04 Nov 2016 15:08

SCIAG
Maneki Neko
Add in to that the record spending by Championship clubs this summer and the increasing quality of the league standards and I think its fair to say the league is much stronger than it was.


increased spending doesn't mean increased quality
its pretty much the same pool of players to choose from, theyre just paying more for them

Nah. The Championship's better placed to attract players from abroad thanks to the money trickling down from the PL.

In 05/06 we had eight foreigners of whom three were Irish. This year we have 13 in the first team squad (plus Hurtado) including two Irishmen. Newcastle have 15 including three Irishmen. I'm sure it's a significant increase across the board.

The increased number of foreigners in the PL probably also means we have better Brits in the Championship.


case in point for my defence- foreign players will cost less than English players, despite often being better

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by SCIAG » 04 Nov 2016 16:36

That doesn't really help you though... :wink:

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by tmesis » 04 Nov 2016 18:12

Silver Fox
tidus_mi2 I would point out something though, are we shit or do you classify our style of football as unattractive? Because it is currently getting the results to have us 5th in the league, if it's not pretty, it certainly is effective. As for the overall strength of the league, the only thing you can do is compare who we lost to who we gained.

Burnely, Middlesbrough and Hull promoted to Premier League
Charlton, MK Dons and Bolton relegated to League One

Newcastle, Norwich, Villa relegated to Championship
Wigan, Barnsley, Burton promoted to Championship

I look at those team change overs and I would argue the league is actually stronger this season.


Pretty much agreed with all of this

"We're fifth so the league must be shit" might be the stupidest opinion on here for some time


Probably just as well nobody actually said that then, isn't it?

The point was that our ability to be 5th without playing well, doesn't hint at there being any great strength in the league this year.

That doesn't mean it's shit compared to 10 years ago. It's just means that there's nothing really to indicate that the standard is noticeably better. It's not as if we've been walking away from games impressed by many of the teams we've played.

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by NewCorkSeth » 04 Nov 2016 20:10

tmesis
Silver Fox
tidus_mi2 I would point out something though, are we shit or do you classify our style of football as unattractive? Because it is currently getting the results to have us 5th in the league, if it's not pretty, it certainly is effective. As for the overall strength of the league, the only thing you can do is compare who we lost to who we gained.

Burnely, Middlesbrough and Hull promoted to Premier League
Charlton, MK Dons and Bolton relegated to League One

Newcastle, Norwich, Villa relegated to Championship
Wigan, Barnsley, Burton promoted to Championship

I look at those team change overs and I would argue the league is actually stronger this season.


Pretty much agreed with all of this

"We're fifth so the league must be shit" might be the stupidest opinion on here for some time


Probably just as well nobody actually said that then, isn't it?

The point was that our ability to be 5th without playing well, doesn't hint at there being any great strength in the league this year.

That doesn't mean it's shit compared to 10 years ago. It's just means that there's nothing really to indicate that the standard is noticeably better. It's not as if we've been walking away from games impressed by many of the teams we've played.

But you could say Villa being 15th shows the league is incredibly strong this year. I wouldn't say that but someone might.

Our not playing well and getting results indicates nothing about the league strength.


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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by tmesis » 04 Nov 2016 20:23

NewCorkSeth But you could say Villa being 15th shows the league is incredibly strong this year. I wouldn't say that but someone might.

Our not playing well and getting results indicates nothing about the league strength.

Who thinks this team, playing a well as it is at the moment, would be doing considerably better if facing the teams of 2005/6?

If this division is better now, then it really can't be by much. Certainly not to the extent of suggesting the 2006 only got to 106 points because the division was weaker back then.

It's a bit of a daft argument anyway, as teams are a product of the division they are in. If a division is 25% better than it was 15 years ago, then getting 100 points, on average will be no more or less difficult then than now, as the 100 points team will be, on average 25% better now too.

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Jagermesiter1871 » 04 Nov 2016 20:53

NewCorkSeth
tmesis
Silver Fox
Pretty much agreed with all of this

"We're fifth so the league must be shit" might be the stupidest opinion on here for some time


Probably just as well nobody actually said that then, isn't it?

The point was that our ability to be 5th without playing well, doesn't hint at there being any great strength in the league this year.

That doesn't mean it's shit compared to 10 years ago. It's just means that there's nothing really to indicate that the standard is noticeably better. It's not as if we've been walking away from games impressed by many of the teams we've played.

But you could say Villa being 15th shows the league is incredibly strong this year. I wouldn't say that but someone might.

Our not playing well and getting results indicates nothing about the league strength.


Sorry I wasn't aware the Villa have been playing amazingly but losing? They're actually further proof of how money doesn't necessarily equate to being better.

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by NewCorkSeth » 04 Nov 2016 20:56

Jagermesiter1871
NewCorkSeth
tmesis
Probably just as well nobody actually said that then, isn't it?

The point was that our ability to be 5th without playing well, doesn't hint at there being any great strength in the league this year.

That doesn't mean it's shit compared to 10 years ago. It's just means that there's nothing really to indicate that the standard is noticeably better. It's not as if we've been walking away from games impressed by many of the teams we've played.

But you could say Villa being 15th shows the league is incredibly strong this year. I wouldn't say that but someone might.

Our not playing well and getting results indicates nothing about the league strength.


Sorry I wasn't aware the Villa have been playing amazingly but losing? They're actually further proof of how money doesn't necessarily equate to being better.

How do they prove that? It's 15 games in? I have my doubts they'll finish there.

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Royal Ginger » 14 Nov 2016 22:24

I think the league is average and we've Simon Churched a few wins giving us a bit of a false position.


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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by NewCorkSeth » 14 Nov 2016 22:44

Royal Ginger I think the league is average and we've Simon Churched a few wins giving us a bit of a false position.

Im stealing that for general day-to-day speech. It will really test my french trying to explain what that means...

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Stockport Royal » 19 Nov 2016 21:00

A minor one but garath mccleary's early goal agaonst Wigan has been beaten tonight by britt assombalonga with a goal in 20 seconds

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Royal Ginger » 19 Nov 2016 21:13

What was McCleary's time, because Hogan got one in 30 for Brentford too?

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by genome » 20 Nov 2016 10:27

57 seconds

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by windermere_royal » 20 Nov 2016 14:44

106 looking in serious danger this season. Newcastle look different class. it will be a shock if they don`t do it now. 67 points needed out of a 87 point maximum,

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Maidenhead Royal » 20 Nov 2016 15:57

So long as our 13 wins remains, we can satisfy ourselves with the knowledge that we didn't have the resources of that team, what with their extortionately expensive squad and former Chelsea, Liverpool, Napoli, Inter and Real boss. We got up on clever use of resources, they got up on abundance thereof.

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Re: Record Watch 2016-17

by Royal_jimmy » 20 Nov 2016 16:34

windermere_royal 106 looking in serious danger this season. Newcastle look different class. it will be a shock if they don`t do it now. 67 points needed out of a 87 point maximum,


I cant see them beating that record. They're a good side but they've lost 3 games already this season and I think they will lose a few more along the way

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