Pauno in

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SCIAG
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Re: Pauno in

by SCIAG » 20 Sep 2021 22:18

Hound Agree we’re where we deserve to be as most teams generally are

Guess it’s human nature to think of ‘what if’ and focus on the what might have beens. Esp true when all our games except Huddersfield have been so close

I’m in the strange position of not having a problem with Paunovic while also thinking we’ve ridden our luck a bit in recent weeks. We’re not creating quality chances, we’re getting lucky with speculative efforts. I’d be happier if we’d been scoring from set piece routines, one-on-ones and tap-ins.

I do think the table often lies. There’s too much that is down to chance in football. Refereeing decisions, injuries, slips, unpredictable ricochets, hit-and-hope, etc. After so few games, the table has more noise than signal. But because the season is so short, a lot of that noise is never evened out.

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Re: Pauno in

by Zip » 20 Sep 2021 22:21

Hound
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Hound 100% Southwood has to stay in

Could be that the likes of Rino, Moore, Rafael, TDB and Puscas all end up on the bench on Sat. None will to be too chuffed.

Pretty sure Puscas will start. Positive he was intended to on Saturday and it was a late precautionary change.


yeah was just an example really. I'd expect him to start as well. Reckon we'll go something like

Southwood
Yiadom Dann Morrison Baba
Laurent Drinkwater/TDB
Halilovic Swift Ejaria
Puscas

Rafael, Moore, Holmes, Rino, Tetek, Hoilett, DD/TDB.

Still leaving out some big names.



Is Dann likely to be fit? Take a look at how strong that bench is. That’s without Joao, Meite, Azeez, McIntyre and Araruna.

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Re: Pauno in

by SCIAG » 20 Sep 2021 22:43

Zip
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Snowflake Royal Pretty sure Puscas will start. Positive he was intended to on Saturday and it was a late precautionary change.


yeah was just an example really. I'd expect him to start as well. Reckon we'll go something like

Southwood
Yiadom Dann Morrison Baba
Laurent Drinkwater/TDB
Halilovic Swift Ejaria
Puscas

Rafael, Moore, Holmes, Rino, Tetek, Hoilett, DD/TDB.

Still leaving out some big names.



Is Dann likely to be fit? Take a look at how strong that bench is. That’s without Joao, Meite, Azeez, McIntyre and Araruna.

Yep nice to have a proper bench - was not expecting that at the start of the season.

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Re: Pauno in

by Sanguine » 21 Sep 2021 08:17

CountryRoyal
Sanguine We're a stupid late QPR equaliser from being a tidy 9th in the table and a point off the playoff places. That's some context.


These kind of comments are a bit daft.

What about the last minute save from Southwood to earn us all 3 when in 9/10 games they would have scored?

Football is a game of small margins, we are where we deserve to be.


I didn't suggest otherwise. I'm simply pointing out that the waves of support for Pauno's sacking, which are still lapping at the shores, if not as powerfully, are for a team that is a silly injury time goal from 9th.

Anyone who wants to (correctly) quote fine margins should also be happy to admit that calling for the manager's sacking on the back of those might be a little hasty.

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Re: Pauno in

by LUX » 21 Sep 2021 08:37

agreed with Cmonurzers

Some (a lot) of the stuff on here was embarrassing. And it will resurface.


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Re: Pauno in

by NathStPaul » 21 Sep 2021 08:45

We are in a lot better position with our squad now and we all saw first hand what we are capable of on our day against Fulham. We had a lot going against us for the opening few games and were devoid of any confidence. The QPR game would have given the players a boost (despite the late equaliser) and the Fulham game will have given the manager a boost and renewed confidence, he must have been doubting himself. He got it spot on on Saturday and I fully expect us to carry on that momentum this weekend and get a positive result.

The result against Fulham is a good time for the supporters to hit the reset button on Paunovic. Lets judge him from this point on now that he has a decent first XI and a much improved bench to support him. The season starts here.

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Re: Pauno in

by Millsy » 21 Sep 2021 08:50

Sanguine
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Sanguine We're a stupid late QPR equaliser from being a tidy 9th in the table and a point off the playoff places. That's some context.


These kind of comments are a bit daft.

What about the last minute save from Southwood to earn us all 3 when in 9/10 games they would have scored?

Football is a game of small margins, we are where we deserve to be.


I didn't suggest otherwise. I'm simply pointing out that the waves of support for Pauno's sacking, which are still lapping at the shores, if not as powerfully, are for a team that is a silly injury time goal from 9th.

Anyone who wants to (correctly) quote fine margins should also be happy to admit that calling for the manager's sacking on the back of those might be a little hasty.


I agree with the general sentiment hence starting this thread but remember it's precisely the silliness of that goal (or goals) that made us so angry. :wink:

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Re: Pauno in

by Zip » 21 Sep 2021 08:59

LUX agreed with Cmonurzers

Some (a lot) of the stuff on here was embarrassing. And it will resurface.


2 wins in 17, most goals conceded of all 92 clubs, bottom three, recurring goals conceded from set pieces at the back post time and time again and an inability to make changes or when subs were made they were poor choices.
We really are not any different to any other set of fans.
Last edited by Zip on 21 Sep 2021 09:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pauno in

by Zip » 21 Sep 2021 09:03

NathStPaul We are in a lot better position with our squad now and we all saw first hand what we are capable of on our day against Fulham. We had a lot going against us for the opening few games and were devoid of any confidence. The QPR game would have given the players a boost (despite the late equaliser) and the Fulham game will have given the manager a boost and renewed confidence, he must have been doubting himself. He got it spot on on Saturday and I fully expect us to carry on that momentum this weekend and get a positive result.

The result against Fulham is a good time for the supporters to hit the reset button on Paunovic. Lets judge him from this point on now that he has a decent first XI and a much improved bench to support him. The season starts here.


He got his subs right (finally) v Posh and Fulham. So yep credit where it’s due but he really hasn’t been helping himself over the past six months with 1) an unwillingness to make subs and 2) piss poor subs when he has made changes.

Back to back wins makes a big difference. Let’s hope we can win again on Saturday. That will put us in such a better place.


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Re: Pauno in

by CountryRoyal » 21 Sep 2021 09:06

Sanguine
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Sanguine We're a stupid late QPR equaliser from being a tidy 9th in the table and a point off the playoff places. That's some context.


These kind of comments are a bit daft.

What about the last minute save from Southwood to earn us all 3 when in 9/10 games they would have scored?

Football is a game of small margins, we are where we deserve to be.


I didn't suggest otherwise. I'm simply pointing out that the waves of support for Pauno's sacking, which are still lapping at the shores, if not as powerfully, are for a team that is a silly injury time goal from 9th.

Anyone who wants to (correctly) quote fine margins should also be happy to admit that calling for the manager's sacking on the back of those might be a little hasty.


If there are any that make a decision of opinion based on just one moment - particularly a late equaliser, then I’d agree it’s hasty.

Some of us have formed the opinion over the best part of a year where the manager has consistently made wrong decisions which categorically have cost us games. Think back to Joao on pens, persisting with him when he couldn’t score and missed us chance after chance, strange substitutions (Millwall etc), no substitutions and negative approach (Wycombe etc). The trend has largely continued this season, taking away from all of the off the field issues, I still haven’t seen much evidence of any tangible change in managerial approach.

Ultimately if we keep winning then most voices against will slowly silence, I’m just not convinced after two wins (one a tad fortunate you could argue) that we are there yet. I feel like we’ve won those games in spite of Pauno and not because of him, at least on a tactical level (we can’t know his effect on motivating players behind closed doors).

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Re: Pauno in

by Sanguine » 21 Sep 2021 09:08

Must admit I'll take the exit door from any conversation where someone claims we beat Fulham in spite of the manager. You're not for turning, that's cool. :)

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Re: Pauno in

by CountryRoyal » 21 Sep 2021 10:25

Sanguine Must admit I'll take the exit door from any conversation where someone claims we beat Fulham in spite of the manager. You're not for turning, that's cool. :)


I’m not actually sure why I made reference to Fulham - I didn’t even go. Don’t normally do that, so apologies.

Im not stubbornly stuck in a view point, I’ve previously said I would LOVE Pauno to turn it around, and I stick by that. Just like it took more than 2 games for me to lose faith in him It’s just going to take more than 2 games to restore it.

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Re: Pauno in

by Hound » 21 Sep 2021 11:02

its tough to judge on Pauno imo. His hand has been so forced by injuries and squad numbers at times. Joao's sudden loss of form last season as well.

Definite signs of how he sees us playing longer term now he has brought in some of his own players. I think there are signs of the attacking midfield trio playing a lot narrower and shooting a lot more from the edge of the box. I think there's a bit more of a move to having 2 proper cdm shields, with the full backs creating the width coming forward.

If Puscas can start getting amongst the goals, signs were looking promising in the last couple of games - then things should turn out pretty well

Definite question marks on the set piece organisation and the persistence with an underperforming keeper and CB pairing, as well as some very dodgy subs, but some good stuff coming through as well - esp the form of Swift and the impact in the last 3 games of Ovie


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Re: Pauno in

by Zip » 21 Sep 2021 11:06

Hound its tough to judge on Pauno imo. His hand has been so forced by injuries and squad numbers at times. Joao's sudden loss of form last season as well.

Definite signs of how he sees us playing longer term now he has brought in some of his own players. I think there are signs of the attacking midfield trio playing a lot narrower and shooting a lot more from the edge of the box. I think there's a bit more of a move to having 2 proper cdm shields, with the full backs creating the width coming forward.

If Puscas can start getting amongst the goals, signs were looking promising in the last couple of games - then things should turn out pretty well

Definite question marks on the set piece organisation and the persistence with an underperforming keeper and CB pairing, as well as some very dodgy subs, but some good stuff coming through as well - esp the form of Swift and the impact in the last 3 games of Ovie



The team have done remarkably well scoring 15 in 8 especially with Joao and Meite out. Most of the goals have been high quality but that’s also a concern. We are not creating many chances. It’s a bit like the start of last season. We are making the most of chances/half chances.

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Re: Pauno in

by Hound » 21 Sep 2021 11:32

Zip
Hound its tough to judge on Pauno imo. His hand has been so forced by injuries and squad numbers at times. Joao's sudden loss of form last season as well.

Definite signs of how he sees us playing longer term now he has brought in some of his own players. I think there are signs of the attacking midfield trio playing a lot narrower and shooting a lot more from the edge of the box. I think there's a bit more of a move to having 2 proper cdm shields, with the full backs creating the width coming forward.

If Puscas can start getting amongst the goals, signs were looking promising in the last couple of games - then things should turn out pretty well

Definite question marks on the set piece organisation and the persistence with an underperforming keeper and CB pairing, as well as some very dodgy subs, but some good stuff coming through as well - esp the form of Swift and the impact in the last 3 games of Ovie



The team have done remarkably well scoring 15 in 8 especially with Joao and Meite out. Most of the goals have been high quality but that’s also a concern. We are not creating many chances. It’s a bit like the start of last season. We are making the most of chances/half chances.


to an extent yes. though Puscas has missed a few from close range, Swift scored from well inside the area and TDB's first was inside the area, and prob should have been converted by whoever it was that missed it first.

I expect the chances we create may well be from good shooting opportunities outside the box. A couple of Swift's, Ejaria's first, and TDB's second, were all from very good chances - just a bit further out. You'd fancy Swift, TDB, AH and Ejaria to a lesser extent to hit the back of the net if they get a good shot away from 20 yards, just as much as you might fancy a CF with a header from close range

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Re: Pauno in

by paultheroyal » 21 Sep 2021 12:14

Win on Saturday and it looks a whole different picture, 10 from 12 will be an incredible return. Confidence high and a certain swagger with the team. Hope Pauno can come through this.

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Re: Pauno in

by Snowflake Royal » 21 Sep 2021 12:46

LUX agreed with Cmonurzers

Some (a lot) of the stuff on here was embarrassing. And it will resurface.

Agree. But you're always going to be able to point to fine margins if you throw away points late on, or make stupid mistakes

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Re: Pauno in

by Snowflake Royal » 21 Sep 2021 12:55

Hound its tough to judge on Pauno imo. His hand has been so forced by injuries and squad numbers at times. Joao's sudden loss of form last season as well.

Definite signs of how he sees us playing longer term now he has brought in some of his own players. I think there are signs of the attacking midfield trio playing a lot narrower and shooting a lot more from the edge of the box. I think there's a bit more of a move to having 2 proper cdm shields, with the full backs creating the width coming forward.

If Puscas can start getting amongst the goals, signs were looking promising in the last couple of games - then things should turn out pretty well

Definite question marks on the set piece organisation and the persistence with an underperforming keeper and CB pairing, as well as some very dodgy subs, but some good stuff coming through as well - esp the form of Swift and the impact in the last 3 games of Ovie

I don’t really see what Pauno has done (unforced) that has improved us.

Going forward has not really been a problem this season. It's been defence. And that's largely improved with the injury based exits of Moore and Cabral, not any management choices. I mean his approach to fixing the defence was just getting Moore and Morro to switch sides.

I don't see what you do when you say a move to 2 CDMs screening either. I think Pauno has consistently moved away from that, and its only Drinkwater's style of play against Fulham (which was desperately needed) which has edged back towards it from where we started in August last year.

I was never calling for his head anyway, but I want to see a whole lot more than a couple of improved results after 20 odd games of shite, before any faith is restored.

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Re: Pauno in

by Millsy » 21 Sep 2021 13:08

If I'm honest, much as I've been Pauno Out for so long, one thing I have really enjoyed is how dangerous we generally look. I don't think I remember a team that seems to pass around so quickly and cleverly and get forward so quickly.

My biggest issue is that I felt he had a lucky first few games which coincided with Joao and Meite hitting form and that with their injuries he was out of ideas and unable to use Puscas or others in any meaningful way.

This season has really questioned my beliefs. We're really not missing Joao in terms of scoring. Puscas is now seemingly being utilised very effectively, he's made signings and is playing a system that just looks very dangerous. Midfielders are scoring masses of goals, whether it's Ejaria, Swift, TDB, Azeez... it must seem like whack-a-mole for the opposition at the moment - they mark one man out and another pops up to terrorise them.

We can't just brush off the "yeah ok we're doing well in attack" like that's some sort of fluke. Pauno has got us playing like that and it's becoming clear it's NOT a Joao-only thing. If anything the Joao-only mindset might have been setting us back. YES OF COURSE defence is an issue and of course he'll go if he can't sort that out somehow but getting Dann wasn't forced. Persevering with Southwood I'm sure won't be forced, it's a real decision he's going to have to make and my opinion is that this 'injury' to Rafael is BS anyway and there's more to it.. None of his signings or the great attacking way we're playing are forced - that's just Pauno. I honestly can't think of a Reading team in the last few years that has been as attacking and competent going forward as this.

I'm not saying I love Pauno all of a sudden, just that I think it's easy to take all the good stuff for granted. Credit where it's due, he's made us a dangerous team to play against.

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Re: Pauno in

by Hound » 21 Sep 2021 13:45

Snowflake Royal
Hound its tough to judge on Pauno imo. His hand has been so forced by injuries and squad numbers at times. Joao's sudden loss of form last season as well.

Definite signs of how he sees us playing longer term now he has brought in some of his own players. I think there are signs of the attacking midfield trio playing a lot narrower and shooting a lot more from the edge of the box. I think there's a bit more of a move to having 2 proper cdm shields, with the full backs creating the width coming forward.

If Puscas can start getting amongst the goals, signs were looking promising in the last couple of games - then things should turn out pretty well

Definite question marks on the set piece organisation and the persistence with an underperforming keeper and CB pairing, as well as some very dodgy subs, but some good stuff coming through as well - esp the form of Swift and the impact in the last 3 games of Ovie

I don’t really see what Pauno has done (unforced) that has improved us.

Going forward has not really been a problem this season. It's been defence. And that's largely improved with the injury based exits of Moore and Cabral, not any management choices. I mean his approach to fixing the defence was just getting Moore and Morro to switch sides.

I don't see what you do when you say a move to 2 CDMs screening either. I think Pauno has consistently moved away from that, and its only Drinkwater's style of play against Fulham (which was desperately needed) which has edged back towards it from where we started in August last year.

I was never calling for his head anyway, but I want to see a whole lot more than a couple of improved results after 20 odd games of shite, before any faith is restored.


i'm absolutely not fully convinced by him either yet - as I highlighted, the sticking with Rafael and MM/Moore was a major negative imo.

I'd say there are signs. Getting Swift to perform like he is, the fluidity in attack when functioning are things we can credit him with I think. Still a long way to go before we can say he has cracked it of course. I'm very interested to see who plays CDM. I'm assuming DD and Laurent but maybe wrong.

Main change for me is pushing Swift closer to Puscas, and in turn Ejaria and AH closer to Swift. Last season Meite was very wide, and think often Ejaria was. We're less direct up to Joao and our best moves come when the midfield work together to get us to the edge of the box

Obvs teams will look at how to counter this and targeting the full backs, who have a hefty workload is going to be challenging

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