if we won the play offs in 95

loyal1 · by **loyal1** » 08 Jun 2007 21:42

if we went up in 95 do you think we would be were we are today or would we have ened up doing a banrsley or a bradford and splashing the cash and then struggling for years on end?

URZZZZZZZZ · by **URZZZZZZZZ** » 08 Jun 2007 21:45

The 17 Bus · by **The 17 Bus** » 08 Jun 2007 22:19

Shaka · by **Shaka** » 08 Jun 2007 22:26

Maybe

Row Z Royal · by **Row Z Royal** » 08 Jun 2007 22:26

Maybe so.

Hemenbruff Royal · by **Hemenbruff Royal** » 08 Jun 2007 22:38

Maybe not

loyal1 · by **loyal1** » 08 Jun 2007 22:43

maybe some of you have the brains to have a disscussion

Hemenbruff Royal · by **Hemenbruff Royal** » 08 Jun 2007 22:51

obviously not

bassavage · by **bassavage** » 08 Jun 2007 22:51

I reckon we'd have gone straight back down and we'd be stuck in League 1 or the lower reaches of the Championship now but we'll never know and I'm glad that we never actually went up in 1995 looking back at it.

The 17 Bus · by **The 17 Bus** » 08 Jun 2007 22:53

I think we would have finished 8th, missing out on europe due to a pathetic home defeat to wat ford.

Millsy · by **Millsy** » 08 Jun 2007 22:55

We'd have most likely screwed up big time. Definitely not ready for it.

And I put it to you that the hunger created by *just* missing out was possibly the best thing that ever happened to us - created in club and fans alike an undying passion to make up for a haunting heartbreak.

Missing out in the way we did was, in retrospect, a Godsend.

As was missing out on Europe the way we did.

Ian Royal · by **Ian Royal** » 09 Jun 2007 01:03

2 world wars, 1 world cup We'd have most likely screwed up big time. Definitely not ready for it.

And I put it to you that the hunger created by *just* missing out was possibly the best thing that ever happened to us - created in club and fans alike an undying passion to make up for a haunting heartbreak.

Missing out in the way we did was, in retrospect, a Godsend.

As was missing out on Europe the way we did.

Spot on. Had we not finished 2nd and lost the play off final being at 2-0 and a penalty would we really all have wanted to make it to the premiership so despaerately? That had been our single driving goal up until last season from since 95. Before that it was always a dream but seemed unrealistic. After we realised it was achieveable and I would say pushed the team on to make it.

Had we gone up we'd have had our day in the sun, we woudn't have stayed there for more than a couple of seasons and playing at Elm Park we'd have lost money hand over fist therefore not being able to yoyo back when we inevitably got relegated. The desire also wouldn't have been there to do it again as much. I seriously doubt we'd have been capable of pushing for Europe or top 8 so our ambition would not have then moved up a notch like it now has.

Katie Marsden · by **Katie Marsden** » 09 Jun 2007 01:32

Ian, how can you say the desire wouldn't have been there? The team that got us promoted was totally different to the one that came so close in 1995. I'm not sure the players from last season ever thought about 1995 much, especially as none were local lads.

If we ever get relegated I'm sure the club would be desperate to gain promotion again, the same would have been the case had we gone up in 1995.

If we had gone up in 1995 I believe it would have been a good thing. We might have gone down but we'd have kept our best players, spent wisely and the money earnt would have been very welcome.

We'd also not have moved into our new ground in the third division of English football. It took the club about 5 years to recover from losing to Bolton. Only in 2000/2001 did we look like going anywhere. If we had beaten Bolton we'd not have been in such a dire position.

I remember in 1999/2000 when crowds were really beginning to tail off and we were lucky to get 10,000. The club could have gone either way then, thankfully Madejski made the right decisions and it's never looked back.

Behindu · by **Behindu** » 09 Jun 2007 07:53

Promotion in 95 would have been a disaster.

Financially it would have crippled us. 10,000 crowds at EP would have meant either prices rocketing or huge debts. A total lack of hospitality and non footballing revenue would have made the problem worse. We would probably have struggled to keep players let alone sign them.

We would have had a disasterous season and dropped straight back out with the whole experience leaving the club shell shocked.

If we had managed to stay up we would have been faced with the massive problem of making EP all seater (just about impossible) and therefore would have had to groundshare somewhere.

Obvioulsy the 95 events live on in the collective memory. Justbecasue players come and go doesn;t mean that history is forgotten. Murts would have played alongside many players who were here in 95 and people like Ron Grant, Kevin Dillon and Nicky Hammond have many links with that time.

In hindsight it was a blessing that we lost, at the time it seemed like the end of the world. We are a stronger club for it and I'd rather have done things the way we have than had the Barnsley experience.

Mr Angry · by **Mr Angry** » 09 Jun 2007 08:29

Behindu Promotion in 95 would have been a disaster.

Financially it would have crippled us. 10,000 crowds at EP would have meant either prices rocketing or huge debts. A total lack of hospitality and non footballing revenue would have made the problem worse. We would probably have struggled to keep players let alone sign them.

We would have had a disasterous season and dropped straight back out with the whole experience leaving the club shell shocked.

If we had managed to stay up we would have been faced with the massive problem of making EP all seater (just about impossible) and therefore would have had to groundshare somewhere.

Obvioulsy the 95 events live on in the collective memory. Justbecasue players come and go doesn;t mean that history is forgotten. Murts would have played alongside many players who were here in 95 and people like Ron Grant, Kevin Dillon and Nicky Hammond have many links with that time.

In hindsight it was a blessing that we lost, at the time it seemed like the end of the world. We are a stronger club for it and I'd rather have done things the way we have than had the Barnsley experience.

Or Swindon's.

Totally agree with everything said above, and would add that losing in the play-off to Walsall was also a good thing (with hindsight).

Everyone thought that there was going to be a load of ITV Digital money the following season, so budgeted accordingly; when they pulled the plug, a lot of teams were left in financial problems.

Of the 4 teams who were competing for promotion in 2001, we were the ones that just missed out, yet we are in the Prem, whilst Walsall have just got promotion from League 2, joining Millwall, whilst Rotherham have just been relegated to League 2.

papereyes · by **papereyes** » 09 Jun 2007 10:23

loyal1 if we went up in 95 do you think we would be were we are today or would we have ened up doing a banrsley or a bradford and splashing the cash and then struggling for years on end?

We didn't have the cash to splash. (and I don't think Barnsley did either).

A better example would be someone like Swindon.

I think those two seasons showed Madejski that we could do it, but also that we'd have to do it the right way.

Bucks Dave · by **Bucks Dave** » 09 Jun 2007 11:12

If I remember rightly, Elm Park did not meet the Premiership conditions and we would have looked to groundshare.

This would not have been a brick by brick growth. We would have been faced with a crap unacceptable stadium, very poor training facilities, a squad without much depth (a number of our Bolton heroes were walking wounded by the end) and a wage bill set to spiral due to the ITV digital flood of money, followed by the crisis of the taps being turned off, all of it hitting us in one go.

Instead, over time, we built a good stadium ready for expansion in a planned manner, gradually improved our training facilities until they are up there with the average Premiership outfit, have a squad with real depth, a management, coaching and medical infrastructure which can cope and a wages and transfer policy that will not cripple us if anything goes wrong.

Mr Mad said that with hindsight going up in 1995 would have been a disaster. I remember Watford going up in a similar fashion around that time and it took them years to recover.

papereyes · by **papereyes** » 09 Jun 2007 11:16

Bucks Dave If I remember rightly, Elm Park did not meet the Premiership conditions and we would have looked to groundshare.

This would not have been a brick by brick growth. We would have been faced with a crap unacceptable stadium, very poor training facilities, a squad without much depth (a number of our Bolton heroes were walking wounded by the end) and a wage bill set to spiral due to the ITV digital flood of money, followed by the crisis of the taps being turned off, all of it hitting us in one go.

Instead, over time, we built a good stadium ready for expansion in a planned manner, gradually improved our training facilities until they are up there with the average Premiership outfit, have a squad with real depth, a management, coaching and medical infrastructure which can cope and a wages and transfer policy that will not cripple us if anything goes wrong.

Mr Mad said that with hindsight going up in 1995 would have been a disaster. I remember Watford going up in a similar fashion around that time and it took them years to recover.

Watford went up in 1999, iirc. They were relegated straight away and then Vialli was hired as manager, spent a lot of money on dross and that's what screwed them.

Coppelled Streets · by **Coppelled Streets** » 09 Jun 2007 12:01

No.

Look at Swindon as the example of why not.

Stadium not up to scratch and the club wasn't anywhere near a position to compete financially.

RG30 · by **RG30** » 09 Jun 2007 12:03

I don't fall for this about promotion would have been a disaster. It clearly wouldn't have, as you look at what Bolton have achieved since then and they are the club we are trying to emulate. Granted there stadium plans for the Reebok were ahead of the Madejski plans at the time, but you never know.

It would have been wonderful to see the 1995 side earn the right to fight amongst the best.

if we won the play offs in 95

if we won the play offs in 95

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