LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Hoop Blah » 13 May 2019 11:43

BR0B0T
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Silver Fox I think they might want another CB, VVD can probably do it all on his own but a bit of help wouldn't go amiss


Always the risk of getting injured as well.


Liverpool were pretty lucky with injuries this season


You mean apart from losing Gomez, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Lallana for effectively the whole season. I think Henderson and Alexander-Arnold both missed a decent run of games too, and Firmino a little in the run in of course (don't think those 3 were that significant though.

They were lucky that they didn't lose any of the front 3 for a significant amount of time, or Robertson and van Dijk either.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by BR0B0T » 13 May 2019 11:48

Hoop Blah
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Hendo
Always the risk of getting injured as well.


Liverpool were pretty lucky with injuries this season


You mean apart from losing Gomez, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Lallana for effectively the whole season. I think Henderson and Alexander-Arnold both missed a decent run of games too, and Firmino a little in the run in of course (don't think those 3 were that significant though.

They were lucky that they didn't lose any of the front 3 for a significant amount of time, or Robertson and van Dijk either.


Gomez i'll give you but AOC and Lallana would be debatable

Alison, VVD, Robertson would have been replaced by Mingolet, Lovren and Moreno (bad as the chuckle brothers at Utd)

Who replaces the front three? Origi, Sturridge and who?

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by sandman » 13 May 2019 11:55

BR0B0T
Hendo
Silver Fox I think they might want another CB, VVD can probably do it all on his own but a bit of help wouldn't go amiss


Always the risk of getting injured as well.


Liverpool were pretty lucky with injuries this season


And opposition keepers dropping the ball at their feet.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Hoop Blah » 13 May 2019 13:21

BR0B0T Gomez i'll give you but AOC and Lallana would be debatable


Oxlade-Chamberlain was probably Liverpool's best attacking midfielder when he got injured. I'm pretty sure he would've been a big player for Liverpool this season if injury hadn't ruled him out.

Lallana's injury problems go a bit further back of course. He'd been exceptional for England and Liverpool before hand though and, for my money, could've been the more natural back-up for wide attackers or adding creativity to the midfield when they were lacking. His injuries ruled him out and he was an automatic starter before them, so you'd have to say they've been unlucky to have him rule out (pretty much for two seasons too).

BR0B0T Alison, VVD, Robertson would have been replaced by Mingolet, Lovren and Moreno (bad as the chuckle brothers at Utd)

Who replaces the front three? Origi, Sturridge and who?


Like I said, they got lucky to some extent in not losing one of those key players (although Milner would probably have replaced Robertson at any point, and not Moreno).

They lost one of their first choice centrehalfs for pretty much the whole season. Matip and Lovren were both injured at times too, with the 15 year old lad and Fabinho playing at the heart of defence at one point, so I think it would be more than bad luck to have all 4 of your centrehalfs injured and out for a significant amount of time.

A bit like with Reading under Pardew and Coppell, a good or bad injury record isn't necessarily luck either. Winning teams tend to have less little knocks etc (see Mourinho's comments on his squad not having the attitude to deal with injuries) and having players well prepared and physically (and mentally) resilient is a sign of good management and training (Reading were never fitter and more resistant to injury than during and just after Niall Clarks time as out fitness and preparation man).

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by BR0B0T » 13 May 2019 13:26

Hoop Blah
A bit like with Reading under Pardew and Coppell, a good or bad injury record isn't necessarily luck either. Winning teams tend to have less little knocks etc (see Mourinho's comments on his squad not having the attitude to deal with injuries) and having players well prepared and physically (and mentally) resilient is a sign of good management and training (Reading were never fitter and more resistant to injury than during and just after Niall Clarks time as out fitness and preparation man).


if you can provide the test that proves this we can discuss otherwise speculation



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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Hoop Blah » 13 May 2019 13:45

BR0B0T if you can provide the test that proves this we can discuss otherwise speculation


I wouldn't be surprised if there are plenty of stats out there to back it up. I'm certainly not going to bother hunting them out though!

Look at Reading's successful sides, or perhaps United for something a bit closer to home. The winning sides were more settled, less little niggles keeping players out for short or long periods.

Players in winning teams don't want to miss games through injuries that could keep them out though. In losing teams, players pull out a bit more as they're not afraid of losing their place and, in some cases, probably want to hide and get out of the firing line.

Also, settled sides without injuries are more likely to be winning too.

Sides with a strong mentality generally do well too. That strong mentality sees players play through stuff too.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by BR0B0T » 13 May 2019 14:12

Hoop Blah
BR0B0T if you can provide the test that proves this we can discuss otherwise speculation


I wouldn't be surprised if there are plenty of stats out there to back it up. I'm certainly not going to bother hunting them out though!

Look at Reading's successful sides, or perhaps United for something a bit closer to home. The winning sides were more settled, less little niggles keeping players out for short or long periods.

Players in winning teams don't want to miss games through injuries that could keep them out though. In losing teams, players pull out a bit more as they're not afraid of losing their place and, in some cases, probably want to hide and get out of the firing line.

Also, settled sides without injuries are more likely to be winning too.

Sides with a strong mentality generally do well too. That strong mentality sees players play through stuff too.


nope, there are no stats that suggest anything other than a correlation between injuries and medical staff etc (bar outliers)

So...

is team spirit/mentality down to winning and things going well

...or does team spirit lead to winning and things going well?

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Sanguine » 13 May 2019 14:14

Loving the re-write across a few social media platforms today that Liverpool only pushed City because they were 'lucky' - most of them omit to leave out things like Sadio Mane's wrongly disallowed goal, of course.

Football fans are fcuking dicks, really. Two excellent teams matched each other almost stride for stride. Liverpool didn't drop a point after 3rd March. City didn't drop one after 29th January. Liverpool's 'poor' second half of the season saw them win 14 and draw 4, equivalent of a 92-point season and enough the win more Premier League titles than not, nevermind 97 points being enough win 113 of 119 top division titles.

An exceptional season, and yet I can see both sides being equally as good next time around.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Sanguine » 13 May 2019 14:15

BR0B0T
So...

is team spirit/mentality down to winning and things going well

...or does team spirit lead to winning and things going well?


Starts with the second, snowballs with the first.


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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by URZZZZ » 13 May 2019 14:17

BR0B0T
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BR0B0T
Liverpool were pretty lucky with injuries this season


You mean apart from losing Gomez, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Lallana for effectively the whole season. I think Henderson and Alexander-Arnold both missed a decent run of games too, and Firmino a little in the run in of course (don't think those 3 were that significant though.

They were lucky that they didn't lose any of the front 3 for a significant amount of time, or Robertson and van Dijk either.


Gomez i'll give you but AOC and Lallana would be debatable

Alison, VVD, Robertson would have been replaced by Mingolet, Lovren and Moreno (bad as the chuckle brothers at Utd)

Who replaces the front three? Origi, Sturridge and who?


Erm...Shaqiri, you know the very one that played in the Champions League semi final and got a vital assist

Mignolet was Liverpool's first choice goalie when they got so close a few seasons ago. Lovren got to a Champions league final and a World Cup final last season playing almost every week. Moreno isn't great but the first two are adequate squad fillers

AOC or Lallana would have been that extra spark in games they struggled to create, not regular starters but decent options off the bench

City haven't had Walker, Laporte, Silva, Bernardo or Sterling injured the whole season either. Can't stand the bitter City and Liverpool fans who claim each other have got lucky. They've both had a really good season but ultimately City have been better. Nothing to do with luck

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by BR0B0T » 13 May 2019 14:21

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You mean apart from losing Gomez, Oxlade-Chamberlain and Lallana for effectively the whole season. I think Henderson and Alexander-Arnold both missed a decent run of games too, and Firmino a little in the run in of course (don't think those 3 were that significant though.

They were lucky that they didn't lose any of the front 3 for a significant amount of time, or Robertson and van Dijk either.


Gomez i'll give you but AOC and Lallana would be debatable

Alison, VVD, Robertson would have been replaced by Mingolet, Lovren and Moreno (bad as the chuckle brothers at Utd)

Who replaces the front three? Origi, Sturridge and who?


Erm...Shaqiri, you know the very one that played in the Champions League semi final and got a vital assist

Mignolet was Liverpool's first choice goalie when they got so close a few seasons ago. Lovren got to a Champions league final and a World Cup final last season playing almost every week. Moreno isn't great but the first two are adequate squad fillers

AOC or Lallana would have been that extra spark in games they struggled to create, not regular starters but decent options off the bench

City haven't had Walker, Laporte, Silva, Bernardo or Sterling injured the whole season either. Can't stand the bitter City and Liverpool fans who claim each other have got lucky. They've both had a really good season but ultimately City have been better. Nothing to do with luck


looks like we've uncovered another secret red?

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by BR0B0T » 13 May 2019 14:23

Sanguine
BR0B0T
So...

is team spirit/mentality down to winning and things going well

...or does team spirit lead to winning and things going well?


Starts with the second, snowballs with the first.


I was actually thinking about your response as I was writing it

knew you'd defo be of that opinion

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Silver Fox » 13 May 2019 14:26

You could say the entire season hinged on two shots that hit the post differently the game between City and Liverpool at the etihad, City's hit the post and went in, Liverpool's hit the post and came out (also somehow missing the incoming Salah) Neither team were lucky to finish where they did, but those 2 bounces certainly favoured City.

I'm sure people will come up with examples where Liverpool got the luck but it's not really a debate worth having so don't bother. There were 2 excellent teams and one of them got a point more and thus deserved the title.


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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by URZZZZ » 13 May 2019 14:28

BR0B0T
URZZZZ
BR0B0T
Gomez i'll give you but AOC and Lallana would be debatable

Alison, VVD, Robertson would have been replaced by Mingolet, Lovren and Moreno (bad as the chuckle brothers at Utd)

Who replaces the front three? Origi, Sturridge and who?


Erm...Shaqiri, you know the very one that played in the Champions League semi final and got a vital assist

Mignolet was Liverpool's first choice goalie when they got so close a few seasons ago. Lovren got to a Champions league final and a World Cup final last season playing almost every week. Moreno isn't great but the first two are adequate squad fillers

AOC or Lallana would have been that extra spark in games they struggled to create, not regular starters but decent options off the bench

City haven't had Walker, Laporte, Silva, Bernardo or Sterling injured the whole season either. Can't stand the bitter City and Liverpool fans who claim each other have got lucky. They've both had a really good season but ultimately City have been better. Nothing to do with luck


looks like we've uncovered another secret red?


Nah, out of the top 6 big teams, I always want Arsenal to do the best, I suppose less so now Wenger has gone, but I'm always quite fond of Arsenal. But City, Chelsea and United are at the bottom of the pile

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by BR0B0T » 13 May 2019 14:31

Silver Fox You could say the entire season hinged on two shots that hit the post differently the game between City and Liverpool at the etihad, City's hit the post and went in, Liverpool's hit the post and came out (also somehow missing the incoming Salah) Neither team were lucky to finish where they did, but those 2 bounces certainly favoured City.

I'm sure people will come up with examples where Liverpool got the luck but it's not really a debate worth having so don't bother. There were 2 excellent teams and one of them got a point more and thus deserved the title.


Certain teams do get more 'luck', defo felt that sometimes when United were battling Arsenal in the 90's

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by sandman » 13 May 2019 14:37

Heaton, Speroni, Rico, Pickford and Lloris each making vital mistakes to hand Liverpool points. Not forgetting Salah being offside to help Liverpool get a draw at the London Stadium in a game they were outplayed in and Mahrez missing a last minute penalty at Anfield.

There is no doubt Liverpool are a very good team and they deserved the majority of the points they earned but come on Liverpool mob, you had a lot more luck go your way than against you.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Sanguine » 13 May 2019 15:01

sandman Heaton, Speroni, Rico, Pickford and Lloris each making vital mistakes to hand Liverpool points. Not forgetting Salah being offside to help Liverpool get a draw at the London Stadium in a game they were outplayed in and Mahrez missing a last minute penalty at Anfield.

There is no doubt Liverpool are a very good team and they deserved the majority of the points they earned but come on Liverpool mob, you had a lot more luck go your way than against you.


If you dissect every goal that every team scored, you can find plenty of defensive mistakes. Which one's matter? The ones that you can assign to a certain team, I guess. It's pleasing to see though amongst Brobot's bantz and some decent discussion, you don't disappoint sandman with these silly Soccer-AM level comments.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Hoop Blah » 13 May 2019 15:13

BR0B0T
Silver Fox You could say the entire season hinged on two shots that hit the post differently the game between City and Liverpool at the etihad, City's hit the post and went in, Liverpool's hit the post and came out (also somehow missing the incoming Salah) Neither team were lucky to finish where they did, but those 2 bounces certainly favoured City.

I'm sure people will come up with examples where Liverpool got the luck but it's not really a debate worth having so don't bother. There were 2 excellent teams and one of them got a point more and thus deserved the title.


Certain teams do get more 'luck', defo felt that sometimes when United were battling Arsenal in the 90's


Got any irrefutable stats to back that up, otherwise speculation.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Hoop Blah » 13 May 2019 15:17

Biggest slice of luck in the title race, IMO, was Kompany not getting sent off when hacking down Salah when pretty much clean through.

That could've meant a 6 point swing.

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Re: LOLiverpooLOL - Next Season

by Silver Fox » 13 May 2019 15:18

Poor old sandman, he must have had a terrible time this season

It's not luck when otherwise decent keepers drop clangers, it's a result of being put under massive amounts of pressure. Was it Jack Nicklaus that said "the more I practice the luckier I get"?

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