Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

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Victor Meldrew
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by Victor Meldrew » 06 Jun 2019 10:37

From Despair To Where?
Victor Meldrew BTW he is a good penalty taker and a lot of his goals have come from the spot but James Milner is even better. :wink:


Victor Meldrew 14% is quite a lot and 50% at the last World Cup..


Wasn't me suggesting that "a lot" or "quite a lot" of his goals come from penalties. Just pointing out that actually, he's about average for players who play(ed) a similar role in their teams.

Unfortunately "an average amount of his goals come from the spot" doesn't really support your rather obtuse point.

I'm just surprised you haven't played the "flat track bully" card yet.

Incidentally, 9 of his 17 league goals came against teams who finished in the bottom half of the table. About the same as Sadio Mane (12 of 22) and Sergio Aguero (12 of 21) slightly better than Jamie Vardy (11 of 18) but significantly better than Salah (18 of 22), Aubameyang (16 of 22) Raheem Stirling (12 of 17) or Hazard (12 of 16)


However, JMW ressurecting the VAR thread last night has highlighted a degree of anti Kane bias on your part going back to last summer, suggesting he has mastered the art if going to ground to easily, :lol:


That is another side issue but yes he does go to ground very easily -that is true though of most modern players.
Not sure why you have taken this to such extremes and even making further suggestions of what I might post.
I have nothing against Kane per se-he is the best English striker around but just not suitable for the current Liverpool set-up.

He might be good enough for England and for Spurs but both of those sides are some way short of both City and Liverpool.

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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by Victor Meldrew » 06 Jun 2019 10:39

The Enfield Royal71
Victor Meldrew
From Despair To Where?
I'd suggest a sample of 7 world cup games out of 300 isn't particularly reflective of his overall career.

For comparison

Aguero has 23 penalties of 164 goals in the Premiership (14%)
Shearer had 56 of 280 (20%)
Henry had 23 in 174 for Arsenal (13.2%)
Wayne Rooney had 23 of 208 (11%). His % might be lower because he shared penalty taking duties with:
Christiano Ronaldo 110 of 601 in all competitions (18%)
Lionel Messi 83 of 603 (13.7%) in all competitions. He's also missed 25. A conversion rate below 80% for a top player is a bit shit IMO.

An admittedly small sample and just a few names I pulled out off the top of my head but 13-14% seems to be about par for a forward who is the principle penalty taker in a Top 4 team.

I got these figures for Aguero, Shearer, Henry and Rooney from a newspaper article published in March that I Googled and the figures for Ronaldo and Messi from Transfermarkt for anyone quibbling the figures.


So the overall point is that Kane and his fellow strikers get a lot of goals from penalties-so what?


But you were the one that made the point in the first place about Kane......

Classic Kes tactic #37885.... double down and deny it.


You keep on about Kes (not sure why) but isn't Kes you or is he reincarnated as some equally dumb poster?

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From Despair To Where?
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by From Despair To Where? » 06 Jun 2019 11:12

So he's quite good for a long ball target man who goes to ground too easily and scores a lot of penalties.

I should point out, I don't like Spurs and have gone on record on here as saying so, have no interest in England but do have a certain affinity and affection for Liverpool (and Everton) as I live in the city and view success for both clubs as good for the place.

I'm just bemused by your rather one eyed worldview when discussing anything Liverpool related as it appears lacking in objectivity and frankly a bit childish and immature. I've not really seen it from anyone else (bar 1) on here when discussing other teams and I certainly don't see it from the many Liverpool fans that I know.

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Snowflake Royal
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by Snowflake Royal » 07 Jun 2019 07:29

genome
Victor Meldrew BTW who the f*** do you think you are deciding that somebody else's opinion is so terrible, terrible?


Because it's objectively terrible.

And anyone can express an opinion that someone's opinion is terrible.

Which Vic's is.

AthleticoSpizz
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by AthleticoSpizz » 07 Jun 2019 08:05

There ya go Vic

Ian has spoken

Time to draw a line under it :wink:


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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by Snowflake Royal » 07 Jun 2019 08:37

A useful contribution as always Spizz.

Tbh, it's quite impressive how Mags and Vic can have such opposite and emphatic views whilst both being wrong and right at the same time.

As ever, these things tend to be a bit more complex than Kane is great / Kane is an overrated diving long ball merchant.

I think the underlying point of the original question is how many of Spurs players are equal to or better than Liverpool's.

It's absurd to say that Kane isn't a peer of Salah or Mane and isn't at least a peer of Firmino. Likewise plenty of Spurs' team can match Liverpool's players.

It's less absurd to say that Liverpool would put Kane straight into their first XI, but still daft and of course Hoop is entirely right that Liverpool would have to change how they play and move / replace other personell to get the best out of him. That could of course reduce the effectiveness of Salah and Mane et al and therefore be a net loss.

Vic's right that football is much more than just finding the best XI players in their positions and crowbarring them onto the pitch. The team should be greater than the sum of it's parts and sometimes you need less gifted players to balance the really good ones. And not every great player is effective with every other great player. Plus egos have to be managed and cost is involved but that's not that relevant to the point.

So Mags is spot on that Kane is absolutely of a high enough standard to be equal or better on what Liverpool have. But Hoop is right that just because he's that good doesn't mean he'd make a worthwhile addition to Liverpool's current squad.

Vic is of course bonkers in his dismissal of Kane's quality and his inference that he's a long ball diving clogger who only scores a lot because he's on penalty duty to convert all his dives.

AthleticoSpizz
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by AthleticoSpizz » 07 Jun 2019 08:44

Hark at Henry Kissinger there.








Lighten up :roll:

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Snowflake Royal
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by Snowflake Royal » 07 Jun 2019 12:15

If you never have anything to contribute and only want to bitch about other people having something to say, why are you here Spizz?

You need to lighten up rather than keep up this weird persecution and inferiority complex you have.

AthleticoSpizz
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by AthleticoSpizz » 07 Jun 2019 12:30

(once again) Don’t take everything that you read from me quite so literally Ian, a lot of it has a humorous slant, some of it is sarcasm, and some of it is deliberate irony, lighten up....


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genome
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by genome » 07 Jun 2019 14:05

I think it would be best for all if we let this thread die.

The Enfield Royal71
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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by The Enfield Royal71 » 07 Jun 2019 16:36

Obviously it would be drama degree daffyd that would think he is knowledgeable about football with another peace and war post and ruin the thread.

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Re: Champions League & Europa League 2018/19

by The Enfield Royal71 » 07 Jun 2019 16:37

Snowflake Royal If you never have anything to contribute and only want to bitch about other people having something to say, why are you here Spizz?

You need to lighten up rather than keep up this weird persecution and inferiority complex you have.


Thats rich coming from you.

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