England - the future....

[Ascotexgunner]

Perhaps he’s got a manager telling him to be a box to box midfielder?

Then his manager shouldn't be in the job or maybe tell one of the midfielders to take the centre forward position when Kane goes walkabout. At this stage of his career Kane should be saving as much of his energy as possible and using it where he's most effective in and around the penalty area scoring goals.

Quite agree, somewhat akin to the ludicrous situation where we previously had some idiot in the England set up putting him on corner duty

Ah yes Mr Hodgson and his very knowledgeable and never wrong (according to himself) sidekick Gary Neville.

[WestYorksRoyal]

This is woeful. I already worry for Tuchel. He's meant to be a top manager, but he's yet another who is playing fantasy football with all these attacking midfielders instead of building a system. Drop some big names, get Wharton in as the missing piece, move on from busted flushes like Walker and Henderson who will be a year older at the world cup, and have a coherent gameplan.

Honestly let me do it. I'll get a coach in to do training ground routines and pressing etc. for me, but I'll pick a load of players that complement each other.

[Ascotexgunner]

No international side has ever won a World Cup with a foreign manager, and I think only Greece have done it in the Euros. Personally I think a Tuchel appointment will end in tears.

Just refreshing my comment as a reminder......
Tuchel is such a bad fit for this job......

[WestYorksRoyal]

In the interest of balance, I should also say don't read into these games. Pointless to have friendlies at the end of a gruelling season and I doubt the players are up for it much. Senegal definitely wanted it a lot more which you wouldn't see at the WC.

Andorra was a bigger disgrace being honest.

[WestYorksRoyal]

No international side has ever won a World Cup with a foreign manager, and I think only Greece have done it in the Euros. Personally I think a Tuchel appointment will end in tears.

Just refreshing my comment as a reminder......
Tuchel is such a bad fit for this job......

Carsley would have been a better fit, continuing the England FC work Southgate started. They've gone for a big name instead of trusting the process.

[BRO_BOT]

No international side has ever won a World Cup with a foreign manager, and I think only Greece have done it in the Euros. Personally I think a Tuchel appointment will end in tears.

Just refreshing my comment as a reminder......
Tuchel is such a bad fit for this job......

Carsley would have been a better fit, continuing the England FC work Southgate started. They've gone for a big name instead of trusting the process.

We can't just rely on getting good draws. Southgate's team usually got beat if we played against a higher-ranked team in the tournaments

[Carnabyswhiskers]

It was difficult to see what the plan was tonight v Senegal, and the players looked uncertain. So many questions: why was Gordon withdrawn, when he looked lively (albeit passing up a very good opportunity)? Why was Kane again left on too long? What is the point of flying Toney over to give him 3 mins + injury time? Saka looked like someone coming back from an injury and produced very little - why was he kept on?
This XI might be worth a try:
Pickford
Livramento, Stones, Guéhi, Lewis-Skelly
Rice, Bellingham
Saka, Gibbs-White, Gordon
Rogers
NB: absence of Chelsea players is absolutely coincidental.

[Sutekh]

No international side has ever won a World Cup with a foreign manager, and I think only Greece have done it in the Euros. Personally I think a Tuchel appointment will end in tears.

Just refreshing my comment as a reminder......
Tuchel is such a bad fit for this job......

But who else was there, he was probably the best of what was available at the time. Personally I’d have tried to persuade Eddie but we know the FA wouldn’t want to pay the necessary compensation.

[Sutekh]

In the interest of balance, I should also say don't read into these games. Pointless to have friendlies at the end of a gruelling season and I doubt the players are up for it much. Senegal definitely wanted it a lot more which you wouldn't see at the WC.

Andorra was a bigger disgrace being honest.

This. Don’t care about pointless stupid friendlies in the slightest.

Didn’t know Jackson was Senegalese though

[WestYorksRoyal]

Just refreshing my comment as a reminder......
Tuchel is such a bad fit for this job......

Carsley would have been a better fit, continuing the England FC work Southgate started. They've gone for a big name instead of trusting the process.

We can't just rely on getting good draws. Southgate's team usually got beat if we played against a higher-ranked team in the tournaments

We beat Germany in 2021 and the Netherlands last year, and people changed the narrative to say they weren't good teams just to suit their argument.

[BRO_BOT]

Carsley would have been a better fit, continuing the England FC work Southgate started. They've gone for a big name instead of trusting the process.

We can't just rely on getting good draws. Southgate's team usually got beat if we played against a higher-ranked team in the tournaments

We beat Germany in 2021 and the Netherlands last year, and people changed the narrative to say they weren't good teams just to suit their argument.

In 2021 we were ranked 4th, Germany 12th

In 2024 we were ranked 4th, Netherlands 7th

Recently, we've been put out of the tournament by France and Spain

(who ranked above us)

[Sanguine]

If you're talking about a time when we're ranked 4th in the world, arguments about who we 'should' beat become a little silly.

[Sanguine]

More broadly - frankly I've got little time for any complaints about the start to Tuchel's tenure. Most of y'all wanted this. Southgate got results, the players loved him - not good enough. So here we are.

[BRO_BOT]

If you're talking about a time when we're ranked 4th in the world, arguments about who we 'should' beat become a little silly.

All I was saying is that we were very fortunate with the draws. Our ranking is possibly somewhat inflated; beating relatively good teams (i.e. top 15) in tournaments adds points. You still have to beat these teams which Southgate managed to do, so credit where it's due.

I'm just not sure if avoiding any decent teams until the very last stages is a repeatable strategy for tournament success.

[stealthpapes]

Our ranking is possibly somewhat inflated; beating relatively good teams (i.e. top 15) in tournaments adds points.

Not really, the effect of a match depends quite heavily on two things.

*(perceived) importance of game
*gap between teams

using the example of England being 4th and playing a team in 5th or 15th, the difference given in the algorithm between the two is tiny (the key parameter is 0.50 for 5th and 0.51 for 15th).

Just eyeballing the algorithm you get more points for winning against the 'odds' than you lose for losing with them.

On a more subjective note, having watched/tolerated England since 1990, I find it mildly insane that the last four tournaments (SF - RU - QF - RU) get the level of criticism they do, when the results and outputs are basically the best in a lifetime. Never passed the semi-finals of the Euros before (and in 1992, 2000, 2008, 2016, it was genuinely thin gruel).

[bcubed]

Our ranking is possibly somewhat inflated; beating relatively good teams (i.e. top 15) in tournaments adds points.

Not really, the effect of a match depends quite heavily on two things.

*(perceived) importance of game
*gap between teams

using the example of England being 4th and playing a team in 5th or 15th, the difference given in the algorithm between the two is tiny (the key parameter is 0.50 for 5th and 0.51 for 15th).

Just eyeballing the algorithm you get more points for winning against the 'odds' than you lose for losing with them.

On a more subjective note, having watched/tolerated England since 1990, I find it mildly insane that the last four tournaments (SF - RU - QF - RU) get the level of criticism they do, when the results and outputs are basically the best in a lifetime. Never passed the semi-finals of the Euros before (and in 1992, 2000, 2008, 2016, it was genuinely thin gruel).

But precisely because the historical form and success has been so poor, when an opportunity comes along you feel you have to take it. And Southgate had chances to win things. Of course he did well in qualifying and getting to semi and a final but not being attacking enough at critical times, with the squad available, is where the criticism comes from, imo

[Snowflake Royal]

Just refreshing my comment as a reminder......
Tuchel is such a bad fit for this job......

Carsley would have been a better fit, continuing the England FC work Southgate started. They've gone for a big name instead of trusting the process.

We can't just rely on getting good draws. Southgate's team usually got beat if we played against a higher-ranked team in the tournaments

Southgate got us to where there weren't many better ranked teams to meet.

Just going to drop in my obligatory, this is predictable LOL at those who couldn’t recognise the quality work Southgate did and England would likely go backwards after him.

[stealthpapes]

Our ranking is possibly somewhat inflated; beating relatively good teams (i.e. top 15) in tournaments adds points.

Not really, the effect of a match depends quite heavily on two things.

*(perceived) importance of game
*gap between teams

using the example of England being 4th and playing a team in 5th or 15th, the difference given in the algorithm between the two is tiny (the key parameter is 0.50 for 5th and 0.51 for 15th).

Just eyeballing the algorithm you get more points for winning against the 'odds' than you lose for losing with them.

On a more subjective note, having watched/tolerated England since 1990, I find it mildly insane that the last four tournaments (SF - RU - QF - RU) get the level of criticism they do, when the results and outputs are basically the best in a lifetime. Never passed the semi-finals of the Euros before (and in 1992, 2000, 2008, 2016, it was genuinely thin gruel).

But precisely because the historical form and success has been so poor, when an opportunity comes along you feel you have to take it. And Southgate had chances to win things. Of course he did well in qualifying and getting to semi and a final but not being attacking enough at critical times, with the squad available, is where the criticism comes from, imo

Good luck in the tournaments yet to come.

[bcubed]

Not really, the effect of a match depends quite heavily on two things.

*(perceived) importance of game
*gap between teams

using the example of England being 4th and playing a team in 5th or 15th, the difference given in the algorithm between the two is tiny (the key parameter is 0.50 for 5th and 0.51 for 15th).

Just eyeballing the algorithm you get more points for winning against the 'odds' than you lose for losing with them.

On a more subjective note, having watched/tolerated England since 1990, I find it mildly insane that the last four tournaments (SF - RU - QF - RU) get the level of criticism they do, when the results and outputs are basically the best in a lifetime. Never passed the semi-finals of the Euros before (and in 1992, 2000, 2008, 2016, it was genuinely thin gruel).

But precisely because the historical form and success has been so poor, when an opportunity comes along you feel you have to take it. And Southgate had chances to win things. Of course he did well in qualifying and getting to semi and a final but not being attacking enough at critical times, with the squad available, is where the criticism comes from, imo

Good luck in the tournaments yet to come.

[WestYorksRoyal]

The game Southgate will always regret is Italy. When we lost to Croatia, we were an inexperienced team who weren't ready. Against France in 2022, we matched a top side and lost out on fine margins that can go against you at that level. Last year, Spain were a class team who could well go on a streak like the class on Iniesta, Xavi et. al.

Italy was the one. Average opponent, home game, and we choked after a strong first half showing.