England - the future....

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Victor Meldrew
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Re: England - the future....

by Victor Meldrew » 27 Mar 2019 10:00

Victor Meldrew
Sanguine Yeah, I think it's pretty negative to state that anything but winning a World Cup or European Championships would be a failure, certainly when talking about this current team and the next two tournaments. A lot of this squad will peak through 2024-2026.


I hope you are right but we have heard all this before-nobody said failure per se it is that to be regarded as the best of their era is to win a world cup or, best in Europe, the Euros.
Also there is always the assumption that every other country in the world will stand still.


In the light of that last line I saw :-
England U21 1 Germany U21 2 at Bournemouth last night.

The game was good to watch in front of a full house and was the right result.
Germany dominated the game from start to finish and were pacier and much more accurate with their passing and a truer reflection of their dominance might have been a win by 3 or 4 goals- I haven't seen the stats but the shots ratio must have been something like 12:2.
The crowd was fairly quiet waiting often for England to do something, which they did to some extent just after half-time.

I watched Foden with particular interest, bearing in mind my earlier post on here , and wasn't disappointed.
He was the one shining light in the England side and , as suggested earlier, is the new Wilshere but with a bit more accuracy in his passing, quicker and less inclined to take on one player too many.
He is though very slight and for the moment that might be against him when playing against seasoned pros.
Nobody else stood out , Sessegnon looks as though he has regressed and Demarai Gray wasn't as quick as I thought he was, Tom Davies from Everton was busy but fairly ineffective as was Harvey Barnes from Leicester.
Solanke worked hard up front with little support.

Look out for Hendrichs(sp?) who played right-back in the first half and, following a load of substitutions, left-back in the second and was a man amongst boys.

Germany drew 2-2 with France a few days ago and France are in our group at the Euros I believe so that tournament looks to be competitive and will do the players the world of good.

There were of course no Hudson-Odoi, Rice or Sancho but again I understand some of Germany's senior squad from their game v Holland on Monday will qualify for this tournament as presumably will Mbappe!!

So I will not be getting "carried away" by the senior team and what it MIGHT do as other countries clearly have their own good players coming through as well as us and only time will tell if ours turn out to be better than theirs.

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Re: England - the future....

by Sanguine » 27 Mar 2019 10:32

Don't then. That's up to you. But if you can't get excited about the current crop, then you never will.

And fwiw that was the U21s first defeat in 19 games, and first home defeat in eight years.

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Old Man Andrews
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Re: England - the future....

by Old Man Andrews » 27 Mar 2019 10:50

It is so boring and old fashioned to be anti England team in this day and age. We should be nothing but immensely proud of our national side and excited about the future. Look where we a short while ago under the guidance of McClaren, Capello and Hodgson! Rock bottom! Now is the time to be excited.

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Re: England - the future....

by Victor Meldrew » 27 Mar 2019 11:07

Sanguine Don't then. That's up to you. But if you can't get excited about the current crop, then you never will.

And fwiw that was the U21s first defeat in 19 games, and first home defeat in eight years.



As mentioned before, this current crop is doing well but this is nothing new and we have had other periods of doing well post 1966,

1970
1990
1996
2018
for example but we didn't win anything which is the ultimate isn't it?

It takes a lot for me to get very excited about anything in sport-I think you will find that is the case with most oldies-as most things have happened before and therefore are less exciting as time goes on.

Seeing England win the world cup was exciting in 1966
Roger Bannister breaking the 4 minute mile record in 1954 was exciting
Running in the All-England Schools cross-country champs in 1963 was exciting
Playing cricket against Barbados 2nds was exciting
Coe/Ovett in 1982 was exciting
Meeting Lyn Davies, Linford Christie and Jessica Ennis was exciting
Seeing The Beatles live was exciting
Watching the first moon landing on TV was exciting
Getting married was exciting
Being at the births of my children was exciting
Watching my son win a sprint at the school sports when he was 8 was exciting
Being told that my spinal tumour was non-malignant was exciting
Seeing Reading play that first Premier League game v 'boro was exciting
Seeing my grand-daughter graduate after all her health problems was exciting
Playing golf at Loch Lomond and Wentworth was exciting


Watching the latest England football team put 5 past a country with a population of 100 times less than ours I don't find that exciting.
I will definitely not have a St George flag flying outside my house if England make it to the quarter-finals of the Euros and are playing somebody as grand as Iceland but will watch games with interest.

Now if you were talking about club football that's totally different but my interest in any of our national sporting sides is minor.

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Re: England - the future....

by Hoop Blah » 27 Mar 2019 11:23

Victor Meldrew Look out for Hendrichs(sp?) who played right-back in the first half and, following a load of substitutions, left-back in the second and was a man amongst boys.


I'd agree, he had a very accomplished game and looks a very good player (and has played for the Senior side).

I felt a bit for Sessengon. He's had a difficult season playing in a struggling Fulham side but he had to play full back last night and he's had most of his success playing further forward. He seems stuck between two positions at the moment and not really getting in a rhythm in either.

It'll be interesting what he does this summer. If he moves to a bigger club (Liverpool and Spurs were interested in him last summer) he might get the chance to play in a more effective side and concentrate on learning one position instead of flitting between the two.

Victor Meldrew So I will not be getting "carried away" by the senior team and what it MIGHT do as other countries clearly have their own good players coming through as well as us and only time will tell if ours turn out to be better than theirs.


Old Man Andrews It is so boring and old fashioned to be anti England team in this day and age. We should be nothing but immensely proud of our national side and excited about the future. Look where we a short while ago under the guidance of McClaren, Capello and Hodgson! Rock bottom! Now is the time to be excited.


I've always maintained an enthusiasm for the England side and seeing it develop and so, although I agree with Victor and I'm not getting carried away by good results against sides who are average at best, I will absolutely get excited by the prospect of this side progressing, competing and entertaining us along the way.

The two are not, IMO, mutually exclusive.


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Re: England - the future....

by John Smith » 27 Mar 2019 16:49

Royal Rother Much the same as Ronaldo looked in his 1st 50 games for Man Utd.

I'd say more like a Jermaine Pennant/Matt Jarvis kind of character

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LUX
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Re: England - the future....

by LUX » 20 May 2019 10:58

LUX Liverpool and Spurs are preferable because they always screw up in the end.



just found this post.

Well, they cannot both screw up this time, so lol at me.

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Re: England - the future....

by Old Man Andrews » 06 Sep 2019 09:06

Think the Bulgaria game will be tougher than a lot of people think, they could be hard to break down.

My starting line up:

Pickford

Trent A-A
Maguire
Mings
Chilwell

Henderson
Rice
Maddison

Sterling
Kane
Sancho

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Re: England - the future....

by Sutekh » 06 Sep 2019 16:29

Old Man Andrews Think the Bulgaria game will be tougher than a lot of people think, they could be hard to break down.

My starting line up:

Pickford

Trent A-A
Maguire
Mings
Chilwell

Henderson
Rice
Maddison

Sterling
Kane
Sancho


Would expect a minimum of 4 points from Bulgaria and Kosovo but, let’s face it, it’d still be almost impossible to not qualify even if England lost one of these two games.


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Re: England - the future....

by Sanguine » 09 Sep 2019 13:08

I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.

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Re: England - the future....

by Old Man Andrews » 09 Sep 2019 13:10

Sanguine I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.

They just beat the Czech Rupublic 2-1............

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Re: England - the future....

by Sanguine » 09 Sep 2019 13:11

Old Man Andrews
Sanguine I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.

They just beat the Czech Rupublic 2-1............


Yeah, I thought the Czechs were shite now. Either way, a vastly improved Kosovo side, I don't think another 4 or 5 goals is a given tomorrow night.

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Re: England - the future....

by Old Man Andrews » 09 Sep 2019 13:13

Sanguine
Old Man Andrews
Sanguine I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.

They just beat the Czech Rupublic 2-1............


Yeah, I thought the Czechs were shite now. Either way, a vastly improved Kosovo side, I don't think another 4 or 5 goals is a given tomorrow night.

They will come here and try to get a 0-0. Really hoping Southgate drops Rashford in favour of Sancho, think we will cause them all sorts of issues with him and Sterling oout wide. Expecting a tough game, lots of fouls and breaking up of the play from the Kosovans.


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Re: England - the future....

by Silver Fox » 09 Sep 2019 13:28

I think I'm totally done with watching England qualifiers now. Their wins are seemingly inevitable and you have to listen to Hoddle's drivel and the rest of the monstrosity that is ITV when they're on.

At least when I watch a Scotland qualifier I'm not 100%* sure of the result

*Prolly about 85%

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Re: England - the future....

by Victor Meldrew » 09 Sep 2019 14:19

Silver Fox I think I'm totally done with watching England qualifiers now. Their wins are seemingly inevitable and you have to listen to Hoddle's drivel and the rest of the monstrosity that is ITV when they're on.

At least when I watch a Scotland qualifier I'm not 100%* sure of the result

*Prolly about 85%


I think we have said about this before and Tyldesley is somebody I just can't listen to.
Saturday was the first time for as long as I can remember that I have missed an England game on TV-the cricket was for me much more interesting.

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Re: England - the future....

by Silver Fox » 09 Sep 2019 14:37

The cricket was a bit much for me, I watched Who Dares Wins with Nick Knowles

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Re: England - the future....

by stealthpapes » 09 Sep 2019 15:26

Sanguine I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.


First official game ever was in 2014.

The rankings are a rolling calculation.

Of course they'll be ranked badly at the start.

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Re: England - the future....

by stealthpapes » 09 Sep 2019 15:30

They do make a compelling case for the UEFA Nations League - in a league with teams of about the same level, they performed admirably and got promoted at the first attempt.

Sure, they'll struggle at times, but the country is small (< 2 million people) and it's only really existed for less than a decade.

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Re: England - the future....

by Sanguine » 09 Sep 2019 15:59

stealthpapes
Sanguine I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.


First official game ever was in 2014.

The rankings are a rolling calculation.

Of course they'll be ranked badly at the start.


Sure. I'm not sure what point you're making. It's a rolling four-year calculation, so their shit(er) results in 14/15 are now dropping off.

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Re: England - the future....

by stealthpapes » 09 Sep 2019 16:23

Sanguine
stealthpapes
Sanguine I was confidently telling the missus that we're playing the group's weakest side on Tuesday (she was asking why the Kosovo game is being played at St. Mary's) and then I read that they are unbeaten in 15 games. They haven't really played anyone of note - their 2-2 draw with Denmark probably their best result, and they've been playing the likes of Burkina Faso in friendlies, but that's still some effort from a side that was ranked one of the worst in the world just three years ago.


First official game ever was in 2014.

The rankings are a rolling calculation.

Of course they'll be ranked badly at the start.


Sure. I'm not sure what point you're making. It's a rolling four-year calculation, so their shit(er) results in 14/15 are now dropping off.


I think its fairly obvious. Of fucking course they were ranked as one of the worst in the world one year into existing as a team. :|

On a related point, we'd had this chat in November 2018. Double :|

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