BFTG - Stevenage

[tee peg]

One of the main reasons I have attended just one game in the last 2 months is that I don't blame the players and don't wish to take my frustrations out on them.

I'm not Chris Gunter's greatest fan but totally respected the response he gave after getting stick at The Mad Stad recently. He said if the players don't play as instructed by the manager, they will not stay in the team.

Actually I would go further and say, if there's one thing worse than having to watch this sh*te every week, it must be having to go out on the pitch in front of tens of thousands of fans knowing the way you are being asked to play will rarely produce the results they are looking for, and even when it does, it will still represent a poor afternoon's entertainment.

I honestly think this, regardless of what McShane and Gunter have said this evening, is what we are witnessing these days,

Most matches start with some enthusiastic passing and the opposition seeing little of the ball, until they get down the other end on one of their first attacks and we concede a soft goal. At that point the heads go down because, again, regardless of what they say on Twitter, they know as well as we do that from then on the match is lost but have no choice but to go through the motions for another hour or more as the stick from the stands steadily builds. Not nice, to say the least.

While they can have a pop at the fans, if they did the same to the manager they'd get fined, lose their place in the side and probably end up training with the kids. Who knows, this might be might what's happened to Popa and others who we rarely see these days

Listening to the post match phone in tonight, I don't think there was one call or text in support of Stam. Almost all of us it seems has had enough and if the CEO is happy to sit on his hands as we drift towards Division One, we need to make it clear it's not acceptable.

In my view, empty blue seats sends a better message than booing the players, especially if Gourlay genuinely believes he and Stam can get away with serving up this sh*t indefinitely.

Billionaires have a nasty habit of spotting lost revenue.

What a great post. Stams micro management is the issue IMO .I had a good laugh at some of the chants yesterday.Gallows humour.
I think that the fans have made their feelings known and its now time to draw a line in the sand and get behind the team.

[Elmpk17]

I think the situation at the club appears to be shambolic. If the team doesn't perform, generally you'll always get a negative reaction from some fans. The trouble is now, the style of play, entertainment, build up of pressure as a team, just isn't there. It becomes infuriating. Each fan may prefer a different style of football, but generally want to feel that the team/manager is giving their all to win. Whether it's a crunching tackle, 25yd shot just over, quick incisive passing, skills to go past the opposition. Currently we don't seem to get any of these. The enjoyment of watching the team is draining. I like the idea of how Stam sets the team up, if, big if, its played with tempo, with a feeling we're going to outplay the opposition and get the fans excited. It continually doesn't/hasn't happened.
Personally I don't boo, never have in 35 years as a fan, but, it doesn't mean I don't understand the frustrations of many. No one at the club seems to want to address the discord between the manager, his tactics, comments and the fans, or even understands it. The fans want to be heard, and one of the ways is at each game. Players have to expect a frustrating attitude from the fans, fans should expect the players to not be overly pleased if abuse becomes personal (not necessarily at chants mocking the drab football on show mind you).
Times have been worse on the pitch, and off it, over the time I've supported club, and we wait to see where this goes. Seems Stam has the full backing of the board, and we might have to deal with this scenario a little longer. Won't stop me supporting the club, but if it means do I spend my hard earned and not plentiful money taking myself and 2x sons to watch what's being shown, that's a different matter I'm afraid.

[Hound]

It’s a fair post Woodley, and I think tbf the frustration from the fans is clearly towards the manager rather than the individual players

Unfortunately though, no line in the sand will be drawn whether it should be or not. The only way sentiment will change with the current set up is if we start winning games, which doesn’t look likely at the moment

[tmesis]

I don't like the use of "true fans".

Absolutely this. Whilst it's all great and admirable they've actually said something (easily done from behind a computer screen) they're not actually taking full responsibility, but in fact furthering the disconnect with the fan base. Because someone boos they aren't a true fan? Yeah ok. Some will be pcunts sure but a lot of these people care so deeply about the team and club which you useless pcunts are making a mockery of.

If fans want stam out, sing about stam getting sacked. Taking the piss out of the players will just make the players dislike the fans, and I can fully understand why players didn't want to got over an applaud the fans. What exactly would they have been applauding - "Thanks guys! Being told how crap were are really helped out there today, and the piss taking really encouraged us to get a result for you."

Players, I'm sure, understand booing at the end of a bad performance. They'll know they've played badly, and they'll appreciate it's a reaction to that. What they won't appreciate is the in-game "motivational booing" and "motivational piss-taking" that many of our fan base appears to think encourages players to play better. It doesn't. It makes things worse.

[PistolPete]

Aaaaaww Im really sorry to hear that players on big wages are upset because the fanbase vent their frustrations at them.
For their info it cost me with tickets, train travel etc around 100 notes.

So just to be clear, because they’re on big money they’re not supposed to care? Yet, generally speaking, you want them to care?

Chris Gunter and Paul McShane seem to be really decent guys; they’re not the flash and entitled players it’s normal to dislike.

The weird thing is, when playing badly, it’s normally easy to pick out the ones who don’t care. Right now it’s the system and confidence to blame and for that reason the fix is ‘Stam out’ and/or backing the players and practicality nothing else.

For what it’s worth, I’d love us to stick with Stam and let him learn with us. One day I think he - like Rodgers - will be a top manager and it will annoy me to see it happen elsewhere!

[paddy20]

Fair play to them both for communicating, though still a big error on McShanes behalf first up

Gunter has come out of this well. Prob the only one

Sadly this is mainly the fault of the manager. It’s been allowed to turn very nasty very quickly and I can’t see a favourable outcome with him still in charge.

Lose at Hull and I suspect it’s all going to come to a head when the owners are here vs Brentford

Stam hasnt helped by his outburst earlier in the season. He should come out and apologise for the display to try and mend bridges instead of saying how tough the opposition were. Their league position suggests other Div 2 sides haven't found them tough! The supporters ire I'm sure is aimed at Stams tactics rather than the players

[genome]

Aaaaaww Im really sorry to hear that players on big wages are upset because the fanbase vent their frustrations at them.

Would you be able to do your job to the best of your ability, if there was a bunch of people around your desk hurling abuse at you while you worked?

[Jagermesiter1871]

I don't like the use of "true fans".

Absolutely this. Whilst it's all great and admirable they've actually said something (easily done from behind a computer screen) they're not actually taking full responsibility, but in fact furthering the disconnect with the fan base. Because someone boos they aren't a true fan? Yeah ok. Some will be pcunts sure but a lot of these people care so deeply about the team and club which you useless pcunts are making a mockery of.

If fans want stam out, sing about stam getting sacked. Taking the piss out of the players will just make the players dislike the fans, and I can fully understand why players didn't want to got over an applaud the fans. What exactly would they have been applauding - "Thanks guys! Being told how crap were are really helped out there today, and the piss taking really encouraged us to get a result for you."

Players, I'm sure, understand booing at the end of a bad performance. They'll know they've played badly, and they'll appreciate it's a reaction to that. What they won't appreciate is the in-game "motivational booing" and "motivational piss-taking" that many of our fan base appears to think encourages players to play better. It doesn't. It makes things worse.

What players had the piss taken out of them?

Gunter can bang on about being disappointed with the fans. I'm fukcing disappointed with the team and the choice to not play a striker against a league 2 team. The main difference being I paid to be there and he's paid to be there. T0ssers.

[Royal Rother]

The fans won’t shout “Stam Out” because probably, like the players, they are scared of him.

[Norfolk Royal]

Well done Chris Gunter for engaging. You should know, as you probably do judging by your comments that the vast majority of fans want the best for the team and respect your efforts.

[Snowflake Royal]

The customer is always right - and seeing as we are nothing more than "customers" now anyway, can't really see the problem with pointing out to the "vendors" that things have seldom been lower since we entered the 2nd tier. Even Terry the Taxi's period was better - at least the players said "oxf*rd this for a game of soldiers" and played their own way for a few games - Sunderland 4-0 win of October 97 springs to mind as a starting point for mini-revival

Oh look it up in Rothmans if you don;t believe me. Maybe you had to be there.

The customer is not always right, the customer is often ignorant and wrong. The person who coined that phrase should be strung up by the ankles as it's continually used to justify unacceptable and unpleasant behaviour.

[tmesis]

What players had the piss taken out of them?

What do you think the "how shit must you be..." song is about, for example?

Gunter can bang on about being disappointed with the fans. I'm fukcing disappointed with the team and the choice to not play a striker against a league 2 team. The main difference being I paid to be there and he's paid to be there. T0ssers.

Sorry, but if you've booed the players throughout, and been negative all game, you shouldn't then be sensitive little darlings and complain about a lack of respect from people you've shown no respect to all afternoon.

The thing that makes not applauding bad for me is that it ignores the fact that not all fans are like that, and those fans got snubbed too.

[Snowflake Royal]

Absolutely this. Whilst it's all great and admirable they've actually said something (easily done from behind a computer screen) they're not actually taking full responsibility, but in fact furthering the disconnect with the fan base. Because someone boos they aren't a true fan? Yeah ok. Some will be pcunts sure but a lot of these people care so deeply about the team and club which you useless pcunts are making a mockery of.

If fans want stam out, sing about stam getting sacked. Taking the piss out of the players will just make the players dislike the fans, and I can fully understand why players didn't want to got over an applaud the fans. What exactly would they have been applauding - "Thanks guys! Being told how crap were are really helped out there today, and the piss taking really encouraged us to get a result for you."

Players, I'm sure, understand booing at the end of a bad performance. They'll know they've played badly, and they'll appreciate it's a reaction to that. What they won't appreciate is the in-game "motivational booing" and "motivational piss-taking" that many of our fan base appears to think encourages players to play better. It doesn't. It makes things worse.

What players had the piss taken out of them?

All of them on the pitch collectively judging by the chants described.

They're trying and following instructions. It's just the instructions are crap, they don't understand how to put themin practice properly and their confidence is shot.

And negative chanting is not going to help at all. All it does is exacerbate the issue, build a divide between player and fan and encourage them all they'd be better off elsewhere. And the same dipshits will get outraged when they leave and are less than complimentary about the club and fans in interviews.

No matter how much they earn, they are still just people. People trying to do a job they love and failing. If fans want more respect, effort and loyalty from players they should try treating them with more respect.

Should something change and we get better, whether it's a new manager or whatever, you think the players won't remember shit like this and continue to resent it?

[Sutekh]

Drop McShane indefinitely, give Gunter the armband. Ilori and Moore need a run of games playing alongside each other, that should be our long term plan.

Oh, and start lining up a dinosaur for a six month contract. We are in serious trouble now

The way things are going he can play who he likes and we won’t improve much

But Gunter-Moore-Ilori-Richards should have been the back 4 for the last 2 months now

i

I've said it before but anyone who went to Derby away must be mystified by a number of things

Why did Richards not play left back again until today? He had a debut to remember. Just outstanding and no mistakes I can think of

Why hasn't Bacuna played in front of defence again? He dominated the game and we played sublime football (really) with first time passes played to our team and people running into space and going for and getting return passes

Instead we have had to put up with JVDB and his permanent liability in waiting
At the same time McShane has slowed down and his game has disintegrated

So yes a combo of Gunter-Moore-Ilori-Richards should have been used. Plus Blackett if wanting a back five

The squad is good and just needs good selection and consistency. It's really not that difficult

Agreed, it’s not the players but the management at fault for this mess. Players are good enough but the management seem to go out of their way to drop players doing well, play players out of position or make demands and tactical set ups in games that just don’t work. Until they go back to the drawing board and rethink it’s going to continue to be a hard struggle with the occasional stumble across a good result. Just have to hope that Reading can stumble across another 8 wins worth of points sooner rather than later.

[LWJ]

I joined in the negative chanting. Is bollocks that it was from the get-go. As stated by multiple sources, there was a fully supported chant of Jaap Stams Barmy Army pre-match

Apart from the people who intertwined it with Stam out?

[LWJ]

The customer is always right.

clueless

[chippc]

Why don't the players take control and tell Stam that it's not working instead of having a go at the fans?

[zaskar]

Aaaaaww Im really sorry to hear that players on big wages are upset because the fanbase vent their frustrations at them.

Would you be able to do your job to the best of your ability, if there was a bunch of people around your desk hurling abuse at you while you worked?

That is exactly what a professional footballer is expected to do, even if it is the opposition fans they normally need to block out.

[10539.4 Miles Away]

The customer is not always right, the customer is often ignorant and wrong. The person who coined that phrase should be strung up by the ankles as it's continually used to justify unacceptable and unpleasant behaviour.

Yeah that Selfridge guy clearly didn't have a clue did he.

If you want a customer to remain or repeat their business then they have to feel that their opinion is listened to, valued and acted upon at least in some way. Of course as football fans we can't all be right at the same time that doesn't mean we don't want to be heard.

[genome]

If fans want stam out, sing about stam getting sacked. Taking the piss out of the players will just make the players dislike the fans, and I can fully understand why players didn't want to got over an applaud the fans. What exactly would they have been applauding - "Thanks guys! Being told how crap were are really helped out there today, and the piss taking really encouraged us to get a result for you."

Players, I'm sure, understand booing at the end of a bad performance. They'll know they've played badly, and they'll appreciate it's a reaction to that. What they won't appreciate is the in-game "motivational booing" and "motivational piss-taking" that many of our fan base appears to think encourages players to play better. It doesn't. It makes things worse.

What players had the piss taken out of them?

All of them on the pitch collectively judging by the chants described.

They're trying and following instructions. It's just the instructions are crap, they don't understand how to put themin practice properly and their confidence is shot.

And negative chanting is not going to help at all. All it does is exacerbate the issue, build a divide between player and fan and encourage them all they'd be better off elsewhere. And the same dipshits will get outraged when they leave and are less than complimentary about the club and fans in interviews.

No matter how much they earn, they are still just people. People trying to do a job they love and failing. If fans want more respect, effort and loyalty from players they should try treating them with more respect.

Should something change and we get better, whether it's a new manager or whatever, you think the players won't remember shit like this and continue to resent it?

Big +1