back from the game - Wigan

[Rev Algenon Stickleback H]

By the sounds of things it was a game where both teams were going for it at the end and either side could have won.

What we've maybe got to learn is to settle for a point late on against teams who are looking dangerous, and only have a go at teams who are a bit in their shell and playing poorly.

We got loads of points being positive late on last year, so it's not an inherently bad policy. We just need to choose when it's best to take that approach rather better than we do currently, as we leave ourselves exposed to much.

We also really need to do something about our terrible marking.

[Plymouth_Royal]

I didn't watch the game but I'm sick of reading all the comments about another dross performance and wanted to throw my 2 cents in.

We play a style of football that has worked IN THE PAST and is suited to the type of player who's main attribute is workrate. It fits in with the Reading Way and I can see why the club are so proud of what we have achieved. However, times are changing and as club going forward, I still think we have not learned from our mistakes the last time we were in Prem.

Our second year we were found out with our way of doing things, our hoofball, our vulnerable defence and our shite centre midfield pairing of Gunnarsson and Harps for the majority of the campaign. Coppell also had his favourites and failed to act on their poor performances costing us our premier league status.

4 years down the line we find ourselves back in the prem with an almost identical situation, except this team we don't have half the team thinking they are better than they are.

At the start of our second season in the Prem, Coppell signed 2 ball playing midfielders in Fae and Matejovsky who were tasked with changing the way we play. So we would go from a team of hoofers to having a more passing style as well. This failed because the whole setup is for a team of workmen and plus the manager never gave them much of a run. As a result Gunnarsson and Harps were our primary midfield pairing and were sadly not good enough for that level.

This time round McDermott signs Guthrie. A quality creative midfielder who I imagine is tasked with adding a new dimension to the way we play. This so far has failed again. Why? Well we have a team of workmen who are used to playing a very direct style and let's be honest do not have much quality. You then sign this one creative player to suddenly change everything and then tell him to change his game to suit everyone else. McD has essentially taken away this players best asset and turned him into the same type of player as every other average central midfielder we have!
Ledge. Amazing in the championship but why did he not get a game at QPR in the prem? Well this season we have found out why and sadly I do not think McD is man enough to address this.
Gorkss. See above
Pog. You can see he has quality and is better with the ball at his feet. But we have not been able to fully take advantage of his quality by the way we play.
Pearce. Player of the season last year and was the best of a bad bunch at the start of this season. Now he can not get a sniff due to "unknown" reasons and is having to witness clowns like Gorkss playing instead of him. I think this is personally an element of experience ahead of youth as Gorkss has always been paired with someone younger this season. Another Coppell trait that backfired in the long run.

So, where do we go from here?
We give the manager time to rectify his mistakes, although he is running out. I really don't know who else could get anymore out of our squad but if McD can make some changes to the blindingly obvious places within our squad, I think we might just about survive. If he doesn't and does a "Coppell" then we will go down, and we can perhaps start modernising our game to a more possession type style whilst we rebuild.

[Millsy]

HNA - what a bunch pathetic pansies.

We're in the prem.

We go away.

We lose by an injury time goal.

And that equates to doom and gloom?

Yes it does. Did you go? We were utterly overrun second half by a side which people somehow expect us to finish above.

All is good.

No it isn't. We're definitely getting relegated. What on earth is good about that?

We're definitely gettin relegated? Rule number 1: don't make statements that will come back to bite you!

What's good about it is I don't care if we do- the championship is more fun :p

But I think it's not a foregone conclusion. All will depend on BMs ability to convince, and Anton's willingness to spend.

I had zero faith in Madejski alone, but with Anton AND Sir John, the right thing will happen in January ... I hope!

[Rex]

We were utterly overrun second half

Nothing changes there then

We seem to not expect decisive passing, direct football and get sucked into ball watching. Narrow way too narrow yesterday.

[RoyalBlue]

Employee frigging handbook, well at least that cheered me up. This is football, he'll get his contract paid off

My point exactly, although like you I don't think the club will consider biting the bullet until it is too late.

Unfortunately McDemott is starting to appear to be something of a one trick pony and that one trick is broken! Just where are plans B, C and D?

[Gunny Fishcake]

I didn't watch the game but I'm sick of reading all the comments about another dross performance and wanted to throw my 2 cents in.

So, where do we go from here?
We give the manager time to rectify his mistakes, although he is running out. I really don't know who else could get anymore out of our squad but if McD can make some changes to the blindingly obvious places within our squad, I think we might just about survive. If he doesn't and does a "Coppell" then we will go down, and we can perhaps start modernising our game to a more possession type style whilst we rebuild.

We're in a catch 22 , we don't have time after the lamentable start yielding a woeful nine points , many go about January , then it will be too late and nobody will want to come to us when we're languishing in the bottom three with 15 points at best

[Hoop Blah]

....For all McD's transfer market failings this last summer, he does get the very best out of a very limited squad.

Is he though?

Are we really seeing the best of Pearce and Mariappa? Is this team best suited to Gorkss being the mainstay of it's defence?

Are we getting the best out of Guthrie and Pogrebnyak? Is Leigertwood playing to his full potential or are we just too outclassed in the middle of the park for he and Tabb or Karacan to cope without more help from an extra central player or, perhaps more realistically, a wide player being tucked in a bit?

We've been close to getting more success in a number of games this season, and the margins between success and failure are all too often very small at this level. If we're not maximising our resources, which are weaker than the rest of the divisions, then we're not going to get anywhere.

Yesterday we yet again gave away too many chances to an average team. Give away that many chances and you're always going to lose tight games because teams will always know they can create those late chances to nick points.

[muddyfeet]

There was reason that QPR let us have Gorkss and Ledge and it's starting to show. There's also a reason why at 30 Jobi has never played in the prem. they just aren't quite good enough. We were promoted last season based on having a great team spirit and a solid defence but that isn't going to cut it now. We just don't seem to have any standout players anymore
I also don't think Jobi should be captain but tbh im not sure there is anyone else to give it to


If Brian plays Gorkss again I really think he may have lost the plot 

[SydenhamRoyal]

He or she is given a verbal warning for under achievement. If performance doesn't improve over a reasonable period (3 months ) then a written warning is issued. Then performance is reviewed 3 months later. If there's been no improvements, a final written warning is issued. If no improvement after a month, then said manager can be dismissed. HTH.


After the manager is dismissed, most organisations will also have an appeal process, which can add perhaps another month or two to the entire dismissal process. So if McD IS the problem (which I am not necessarily saying) he should be out by July.

I don't think you really know (or a re acknowledging) what often happens at higher levels in organisations. What your Employee Handbook says is one thing. What happens in practice is often different. You'll often find that, where the manager is in a critical position, damage limitation will kick in and a compromise agreement will be reached. This allows both parties to move on quickly.

Given I am right near the top of such an organisation I do know. My post just reflected the despair in getting rid of under performing staff. Getting compromise agreements is quite easy for BBC DGs and football team managers -you just pay them what they would have got anyway if they had stayed on in post.

[windermere_royal]

Saints winning, it just gets better and better.

[Victor Meldrew]

Saints winning, it just gets better and better.

Pardew out?

[RoyalBlue]

Saints winning, it just gets better and better.

And they are completely dominating their game (wonder what that's like to watch? ) 11 shots to 1 and six of those on target.

[RoyalBlue]

He or she is given a verbal warning for under achievement. If performance doesn't improve over a reasonable period (3 months ) then a written warning is issued. Then performance is reviewed 3 months later. If there's been no improvements, a final written warning is issued. If no improvement after a month, then said manager can be dismissed. HTH.


After the manager is dismissed, most organisations will also have an appeal process, which can add perhaps another month or two to the entire dismissal process. So if McD IS the problem (which I am not necessarily saying) he should be out by July.

I don't think you really know (or a re acknowledging) what often happens at higher levels in organisations. What your Employee Handbook says is one thing. What happens in practice is often different. You'll often find that, where the manager is in a critical position, damage limitation will kick in and a compromise agreement will be reached. This allows both parties to move on quickly.

Given I am right near the top of such an organisation I do know. My post just reflected the despair in getting rid of under performing staff. Getting compromise agreements is quite easy for BBC DGs and football team managers -you just pay them what they would have got anyway if they had stayed on in post.

Funny the organisations I have worked for and/or know (not the BBC) do use compromise agreements and don't pay anything like as much as that! But I think we are in agreement, there is no such thing as process or job security for most football managers.

[Royal91]

Such a depressing weekend. If we drew I would of been happy.

I don't think the players will be able to handle the pressure in the Villa game.

[RoyalBlue]

Such a depressing weekend. If we drew I would of been happy.

I don't think the players will be able to handle the pressure in the Villa game.

Quite,. I was really happy with a few minutes remaining and a point gifted back to us. Then some barsteward on here predicted they would score the winner on 92 minutes and it all went to rat shyte and a foul mood!

[Snowball]

I couldn't go to the game, couldn't get the internet stream to work

On the radio, we mostly sounded outplayed and shambolic in defence
and they are usually kind to us.

We were gifted the equaliser for 2-2, maybe got away with that "offside" goal
but then we had a stone-wall penalty denied us.




So I watched MotD and was surprised to see (highlights only, obviously) that we
looked to be in the game throughout. I also though (tho' Gorkss had a torrid time)
that their midfield were putting some great balls thru and their LW was on fire on
the day.

My question is, sure we look ragged in defense, but MotD seemed to think it was
a good end-to-end game and a point wouldn't have been robbery - so was it baaad
or was it (overall) the way MotD portrayed it?

[RoyalBlue]

Can one or more of those defending McDermott please explain why, when we wanted to see out the game, bringing Pog on rather than Hunt was the right move?

[ManchesterRoyals]

Can one or more of those defending McDermott please explain why, when we wanted to see out the game, bringing Pog on rather than Hunt was the right move?

Im not defending him but he must of thought we could have won it hence Pog but im the same as you why

[RoyalBlue]

Can one or more of those defending McDermott please explain why, when we wanted to see out the game, bringing Pog on rather than Hunt was the right move?

Im not defending him but he must of thought we could have won it hence Pog but im the same as you why

I think Hunt would also have given us as much chance of winning as Pog. Also a bit hypocriticl of Brian to now moan at the players for failing to close out the game if he brought on Pog to go for the win!