BFTG - Sheffield

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SCIAG
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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by SCIAG » 04 Aug 2019 09:22

Starting line up for me was a Brazil-style 4-2-2-2 with Barrett as the left AM and Loader as the right AM. I definitely got the impression that Loader was defensively supposed to cover that area.

At the start of the second half we tried swapping them with the notional strikers but I don't think that lasted very long.

So, yeah, some limits to the use of fixed positions to describe that front four, and Loader wasn't playing as a traditional winger, but of the four he was playing furthest right most of the time.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by sandman » 04 Aug 2019 09:25

Is signing Miazga and Morrison that difficult to understand? At the start of pre season we only had one senior centre back.

Signing at least two had to be a priority given how are, bar one game each, untested McIntyre and Osho are at this level.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Maneki Neko » 04 Aug 2019 09:42

Jack Celliers It was OK. Moore's mistake was a bit of a surprise, but we came back with a nice equaliser, then gave away another soft goal.

I thought we would get an equaliser, but then Adam came on, and that was it really. It must have been soul-destroying for the rest of the team who had been so careful with the ball - Swift especially - to see him come on and spray hollywood balls into touch.



Ahahahahahaha

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Snowflake Royal » 04 Aug 2019 10:33

Zip Youmi’s comments concern me. Surely our players are match fit? Why are they looking knackered well before full time? The one thing we know about the Championship is that teams need to be fit.

Part of the problem seems to be we do not know the best position for certain players. Is Meite best playing on the wing? What is Loader’s best position? I have no idea. Was Swift really playing in a CDM role for the first half? Surely not.

We had a very young side playing yesterday. It must have been one of the youngest sides we have played at this level. I’m not sure that’s wise. I don’t see how we can leave someone capable of captaining a team that finished higher up the table on the bench? It seems odd we bought Morrison when we were clearly looking to bring in Miazga too and have McIntyre playing really well.

Early days but this lot must be as fit as other teams otherwise we will see a repeat of Stam’s second season and lots of late goals conceded.


We were playing IMO:

......................Virginia
..Yiadom, Moore, Miazga, Richards
...............Rinomhota, Swift
Meite.............Loader.................Barrett
.......................Barrow

But Barrow spent a lot of time dropping deep or out on the left, Meite spent time going up top and Loader spent time drifting out right wide. Barrett is really the only one who held any sort of position.

Sadly Loader picked up where he left off last season. Looking like he had a very good touch, but lost in that role and not doing anywhere near enough to make something happen. Spent so much of the time with back to a defender and then just pass backwards. Yiadom in particular bombed on loads leaving us very exposed, and Rino basically had to spend half the game playing three positions at once, RB, CB and CM. Things were better on the left as Richards was better defensively and Barrett positionally, otherwise god knows what would have happened with Swift needing to fill in defensively.

I was surprised Miazga started given Morrison had seemed decent and Miazga looked leggy and short of pre-season against Chelsea. But he was considerably better than Moore.

So it looked more like:

......................Virginia
...........Moore.........Miazga, Richards
..............Rinomhota, Swift
Yiadom..Loader..........................Barrett
.............Meite.........................Barrow

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by leon » 04 Aug 2019 11:09

URZZZZ
leon
URZZZZ
Sorry but you're deluded if you think Adam was better than Swift. Swift was by far our best player and that's coming from someone who doesn't really rate him (funny how Swift has had very little credit for his pass to Yiadom for the handball shot btw). Richards and Virginia aside, the other 8 starters ranged from shocking to poor


What did Swift actually do? Ok he played one ball to Yiadom. And? He didn’t affect the midfield at all, we we were overrun and we didn’t create anything from the midfield.

Adam played some actual passes to players that meant we were in an attacking position.

What did Swift actually do?


The impetus is always on the midfield to create. But for a midfielder to create, you need the attackers to move. Of the four attackers, Meite was the only one to move. Loader and Barrett just stood still and I have no idea what Barrow was doing. Swift made the best of a bad situation

But him and Rino aren’t the solution to the two holding midfielders. That’s obvious. That and a striker is an absolute must before Thursday


I agree with most of that. The movement throughout midfield and attack is shocking.

Olise was a massive improvement he actually got into space to receive the ball that stretched them.


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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by 3points » 04 Aug 2019 11:12

Snowflake Royal
SCIAG The benefits of being a pessimist are that you can lose 3-1 and not be disappointed.

The uncontrollable out the way first: Wednesday handled the ball on the line without the referee seeing it. Should really have been a goal if they hadn't cheated, as they did cheat then it should have been a red and a penalty. Also thought the referee let the tactical fouling go unpunished a bit too long.

In terms of structure, I don't think the 4-2-2-2 really worked. Would prefer a 4-3-3... but then, we don't have enough midfielders. Barrett had a reasonable game but we didn't offer enough of an attacking threat, we didn't get behind them very often and we didn't put dangerous balls into the box. We had "fluidity" in the sense that nobody knew where they were playing, but not in the sense of being difficult to mark or using space intelligently. Yiadom and Richards pushed very high in order to give us some width, which left us exposed a few times and contributed to the second goal. Thought Richards had a good game though. We look very reliant on Meite, nobody else was going to put the ball in the net.

Player ratings:

Virginia 5.5 - impressed by how commanding he was in the box, but could have dealt better with some of the shots. Definitely not ruling him out but he'll be disappointed by that debut.
Yiadom 5 - ineffective going forward and a defensive liability which Wednesday exploited.
Miazga 6 - one really good block
Moore 5 - probably his worst game for us, some really significant errors.
Richards 6 - not great going forward but didn't get exposed defensively, which was a real possibility given he had Barrett and Swift in front of him. One excellent tackle harshly given as a foul.
Rinomhota 6.5 - drew a lot of fouls through his good ball carrying, but misplaced a pass before the first goal.
Swift 6.5 - adapted quite well to the new role. Protected the ball very well in a couple of tight spaces and put in one very good tackle. Played some clever passes but nothing particularly significant.
Loader 4.5 - not at all comfortable on the right wing. Slowed down our counter attacks and didn't offer any attacking threat.
Barrett 6 - really good pass for the goal and tracked back quite well. Needs to offer a little bit more of a threat.
Barrow 5 - did well for the red card but otherwise didn't offer enough. Down the left please.
Meite 6.5 - took his goal well and should have had another but for the cheating. Also missed a few headed chances.

Olise 6 - clearly has vision and class. More please.
Adam 6 - could have been much worse. Some good passes although needs to calibrate a bit better.
Nova - no time



This here highlights the exact problem we have. Two people went to the game and watched the match. SCIAG thinks Loader was supposed to be playing right wing. I think he was supposed to be playing No. 10. Three of our front four were actually playing 'oxf*rd knows' where.

Think it says more about you Ian. Very clear he was playing on the right hand side, but not as a winger. Too narrow for that and he was meant to allow space for Yiadom to get into. It’s easy to tell where players are playing when it comes to the defensive duties. Loader was always on the RHS until half time, constantly checking to see where their LB was. He was playing in an unnatural position and you could see him thinking constantly about where he should be. I was sat behind the dugout so he was right in front of me most of the first half.

Then Gomes switched it at HT with Barrow wide left, Meite wide right with Loader leading the line and Barrett in the No 10 slot.

Mo Barrow is not a winger. He cannot cross the ball. But I do like it when he plays as a second striker, using his pace to stretch defences, which is what he did in the second half of last season. I think Gomes wants Boye to play where Loader did yesterday and Ejaria in the Barrett position. Think that will look more 4-3-3 than it did yesterday, which felt more 4-2-2-2 or 4-2-4 in some instances

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by 3points » 04 Aug 2019 11:15

SCIAG Starting line up for me was a Brazil-style 4-2-2-2 with Barrett as the left AM and Loader as the right AM. I definitely got the impression that Loader was defensively supposed to cover that area.

At the start of the second half we tried swapping them with the notional strikers but I don't think that lasted very long.

So, yeah, some limits to the use of fixed positions to describe that front four, and Loader wasn't playing as a traditional winger, but of the four he was playing furthest right most of the time.

Exactly how I saw it

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Platypuss » 04 Aug 2019 11:25

Barrow just so weak when receiving the ball with his back to goal. Did he manage to shield the ball even once?

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Snowflake Royal » 04 Aug 2019 11:32

3points
SCIAG Starting line up for me was a Brazil-style 4-2-2-2 with Barrett as the left AM and Loader as the right AM. I definitely got the impression that Loader was defensively supposed to cover that area.

At the start of the second half we tried swapping them with the notional strikers but I don't think that lasted very long.

So, yeah, some limits to the use of fixed positions to describe that front four, and Loader wasn't playing as a traditional winger, but of the four he was playing furthest right most of the time.

Exactly how I saw it

Fair enough, first half defensive duties were the wrong end for me and it mostly looked like a total shambles on our right side.

Whatever we played the front four were all over the place and we basically didn't have a striker.


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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by stealthpapes » 04 Aug 2019 11:48

Caught the 'highlights'.

Three very soft goals.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by BR0B0T » 04 Aug 2019 12:22

Snowflake Royal
3points
SCIAG Starting line up for me was a Brazil-style 4-2-2-2 with Barrett as the left AM and Loader as the right AM. I definitely got the impression that Loader was defensively supposed to cover that area.

At the start of the second half we tried swapping them with the notional strikers but I don't think that lasted very long.

So, yeah, some limits to the use of fixed positions to describe that front four, and Loader wasn't playing as a traditional winger, but of the four he was playing furthest right most of the time.

Exactly how I saw it

Fair enough, first half defensive duties were the wrong end for me and it mostly looked like a total shambles on our right side.

Whatever we played the front four were all over the place and we basically didn't have a striker.


Hang on...you lads stay sober when watching Reading??????!?!?!?!?!

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Snowflake Royal » 04 Aug 2019 12:46

BR0B0T
Snowflake Royal
3points Exactly how I saw it

Fair enough, first half defensive duties were the wrong end for me and it mostly looked like a total shambles on our right side.

Whatever we played the front four were all over the place and we basically didn't have a striker.


Hang on...you lads stay sober when watching Reading??????!?!?!?!?!

I had a pint, read into that what you want. :wink:

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Danny Nedelko » 04 Aug 2019 13:28

Midfield was a mess and Jose has to rethink formation for the next game. Meite cannot play with his back to goal and was on his own most of the first half. Some our first touches were terrible too, Barrow notably guilty. Loader looked completely lost and slowed everything down, not once playing the ball forward and Barrett didnt really offer anything either.

Swift looked about as good as I have seen him play, seemed to be strong on the ball for once so must have been doing some squats and deadlifts over the summer. Not many other positives.

All in all a pretty crap performance, but it was the first game of the season and we have Boye to come in plus hopefully another signing or two (a fricking striker please). As someone else has said, Jose hasnt spent a penny and we absolutely need to back him.....keep the faith.


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leon
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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by leon » 04 Aug 2019 13:36

Platypuss Barrow just so weak when receiving the ball with his back to goal. Did he manage to shield the ball even once?


Always looking for the foul and then laying on the floor. Pretty pathetic.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Reading4eva » 04 Aug 2019 13:40

We weren't that much worse than them. This new keeper fills me with no confidence at all.

https://youtu.be/UdmDHBmh1js

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Ascotexgunner » 04 Aug 2019 13:43

URZZZZ
RoyalBlue
Muskrat
No I don't believe he did improve us to any significant degree last season. We were 21st when he took over and finished 20th, so only the most marginal of improvements and I think Clement would have done at least as well. As for this season it goes without saying that it's far too early to judge and here's hoping at the end of September we're up around mid table and, importantly, can also see some tangible footballing style and ethos developing.


Clueless Clement would've done just as well?!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


You mean clueless Clement who kept us up the season before and Swansea (in the Premier League) up the season before that. You talking about that Clement, right?


And Swansea then lost 11 in 13 and Swansea went down after he started them on their jolly way into a downward spiral.
He didnt at keep us up at all.....the other crap teams around us did. We would be a league one side now with that useless sod had stayed. Oh and he bought some utter turkeys with the money he was given.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Victor Meldrew » 04 Aug 2019 13:47

Most things covered already.
Last season we let Bannen run the game so this year...we let Bannen run the game.
Do our scouts actually watch other teams or is it all about how we play?
When I saw the line-up I thought it was expecting too much to play Loader AND Barrett against a seasoned, rugged opposition.

I don't get why the manager always picks Loader and clearly tries to get him into the side.
It is obvious that he is no midfield player and lacks the imagination and speed of thought to play there.
Barrett, all right foot, played nearly every ball back to the centre-backs and had neither the skill nor the pace to take a player on the outside.

With neither of these doing much it was left to Rino and Swift to do everything and neither had their best of games-Rino can surely be forgiven as this was a rarity.

I agree with those who pointed out Gomes describing Moore's position on the right being because of his attacking play.
There is a reason why centre-backs are centre-backs and not midfielders-there aren't too many Bobby Moores, Beckenbauers or Van Dijks.
Lastly, are we the softest side in this division?
The ref may have let things go (he did book 3 of theirs and sent the keeper off) but it is embarrassing the number of times our players go to ground and Yiadom's swallow dive late on in their area was pathetic.

I think we desperately need a focal point central striker in the Yann, Oliveira mould and I hope we don't end up with a Billy Sharp/ Gary Hooper type.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Hound » 04 Aug 2019 14:16

It’s one thing that NO certainly gave us - being a tough and unpleasant player to play against. We are certainly still too soft as a side - mentioned this a lot last year. Way too nice....

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by Ascotexgunner » 04 Aug 2019 14:32

I thought Adam was brilliant yesterday, showed fire and passion, tried to get the crowd going and was in the refs face as well as Wednesday players. His passing was imaginative and it wasn't for the fact the likes of Barrow couldn't control a bag of cement we may have created more. Would have been my MOTM if he had decked Swift over the free kick. He is younger than say Milner and wondered if he could last ninety minutes....he is after all, only 33.

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Re: BFTG - Sheffield

by SCIAG » 04 Aug 2019 15:39

BR0B0T
Snowflake Royal
3points Exactly how I saw it

Fair enough, first half defensive duties were the wrong end for me and it mostly looked like a total shambles on our right side.

Whatever we played the front four were all over the place and we basically didn't have a striker.


Hang on...you lads stay sober when watching Reading??????!?!?!?!?!

Have you seen the prices at the Madejski?

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