BFTG - Norwich

[windermereROYAL]

Relax we can still get 119 points. It`s not looking great after 8 games but to say we are down already is premature in the extreme.

[Stranded]

At what point does it become bad enough that he has to go though?

For me, Clement could take us down and still remain in the job.

Your thoughts?

I feel a change is around the corner, home defeat to Hull does it I think. I would be happy to keep him as I don't think it is his fault at all but with the new sporting director coming in I believe the manager could change quite quickly. Gourlay is the one who has to go in my opinion.

Gourlay going throws the club into even more turmoil. He is clearly working to a cost cutting brief, at least away from the 1st team, and is bringing in people who fit with the way the club apparently needs to go forward. If Gourlay goes, does Nani go? Who else in the background goes, would the manager change as well, whether that is Clement or A.N.Other?

[bcubed]

Didn’t realise Ilori may have been at fault for the second goal. If true he drops to a 5.

He absolutely was at fault.
From memory he tackled with the wrong foot but in any case should have taken the ball and man if necessary and cleared both into touch. It was half hearted at best.

Yes and then the ball was played in. To Moore, whose "clearance" was straight to a Norwich player about 3M away. Who then has enough time in the box to set himself up to score.

Also how were Norwich able to just walk through our midfield from kick off?

If we're going to do blame, let's get it right eh?

Ilori makes the tackle the move ends there

[John Smith]

JS can you name 3 teams you think will finish below us, and detail why?

Rotherham United: weakest team in the division with regards to quality. Not a big enough budget/attractive enough to recruit the right players to keep them up.

Birmingham City: flirted with relegation for years, no real quality in their side and certainly no depth either. Have had to rely on loan deals and lack the unity needed for a long slog in the Championship. They also haven't won a game yet and have only scored 5 goals so far this season.

Preston North End: I looked at their squad in quite a lot of detail before the weekend and couldn't really recognise any of their players. A lot of dross, no depth and I feel that Alex Neil is being found out now that most of Grayson's team is no longer there. A poor start to the season and not a lot of goals in the side is going to be their downfall.

Bolton Wanderers: Just dross. Their Championship clock is ticking. If not this season then they will go next.

[leon]

He absolutely was at fault.
From memory he tackled with the wrong foot but in any case should have taken the ball and man if necessary and cleared both into touch. It was half hearted at best.

Yes and then the ball was played in. To Moore, whose "clearance" was straight to a Norwich player about 3M away. Who then has enough time in the box to set himself up to score.

Also how were Norwich able to just walk through our midfield from kick off?

If we're going to do blame, let's get it right eh?

Ilori makes the tackle the move ends there

If midfield intercept before he gets there, illori doesn't get to make the tackle. Ends there.

[leon]

JS can you name 3 teams you think will finish below us, and detail why?

Rotherham United: weakest team in the division with regards to quality. Not a big enough budget/attractive enough to recruit the right players to keep them up.

Birmingham City: flirted with relegation for years, no real quality in their side and certainly no depth either. Have had to rely on loan deals and lack the unity needed for a long slog in the Championship. They also haven't won a game yet and have only scored 5 goals so far this season.

Preston North End: I looked at their squad in quite a lot of detail before the weekend and couldn't really recognise any of their players. A lot of dross, no depth and I feel that Alex Neil is being found out now that most of Grayson's team is no longer there. A poor start to the season and not a lot of goals in the side is going to be their downfall.

Bolton Wanderers: Just dross. Their Championship clock is ticking. If not this season then they will go next.

You've started early this season.

[NewCorkSeth]

He absolutely was at fault.
From memory he tackled with the wrong foot but in any case should have taken the ball and man if necessary and cleared both into touch. It was half hearted at best.

Yes and then the ball was played in. To Moore, whose "clearance" was straight to a Norwich player about 3M away. Who then has enough time in the box to set himself up to score.

Also how were Norwich able to just walk through our midfield from kick off?

If we're going to do blame, let's get it right eh?

Ilori makes the tackle the move ends there

Didn't the cross go straight through Gunters legs?

[bcubed]

Yes and then the ball was played in. To Moore, whose "clearance" was straight to a Norwich player about 3M away. Who then has enough time in the box to set himself up to score.

Also how were Norwich able to just walk through our midfield from kick off?

If we're going to do blame, let's get it right eh?

Ilori makes the tackle the move ends there

If midfield intercept before he gets there, illori doesn't get to make the tackle. Ends there.

I just recall a straightforward tackle right in front of me that should be made 10 times out of 10. Midfield interception? Dunno. Have to see it again.

It's academic anyway. We're a powderpuff team. Each player capable of weakness at any time

[Coppells Lost Coat]

I am still struggling to find a reason why we still cant compete in midfield and why it is still a problem. There is absolutely no excuse that our shambles has gone on for so long.
Gunter and Aluko if they HAVE to play (which i hope they dont for a while) should not be on the same side.
Clement needs to sort his tactics out to the players we have not a style of play. Punting it up top to Baldock wasn't going to work then you add in a lack of midfield competing for 2nd balls. Unacceptable.

[Snowball]

Yes and then the ball was played in. To Moore, whose "clearance" was straight to a Norwich player about 3M away. Who then has enough time in the box to set himself up to score.

Also how were Norwich able to just walk through our midfield from kick off?

If we're going to do blame, let's get it right eh?

Ilori makes the tackle the move ends there

If midfield intercept before he gets there, illori doesn't get to make the tackle. Ends there.

If the referee abandons the game after we score...

[gazzer, loyal royal]

Interestingly enough Madejski was in the hotel last night and was talking to a few fans. appeared to me through was he was intimating is that there are serious problems within the club, and problems he doesn't want to get involved in

[Westwood52]

OMG. That 1st half was as bad as anything Jap came up with. Then for 20 minutes we dominated, only to make a calamitous error (midfield and defence), at best naïve on that 2nd goal.
IMHO:

Walker 5: He is probably a bit thick, never knows what he is doing. But not at fault last night.

Gunter -1: Has to go and have a rethink. Totally not up for a fight. Must be someone can play LB; even if they don't cross the half way line.
Yiadom 4: Pretty good 1st half-excellent effort on goal-then his game fell apart. Back to RB.
Moore 4: Has one eye on getting away in January. Not engaged with getting us out of this.
Ilori 2: That tackle which led to the 2nd goal will live in my memory for a long time. But had no support from midfield or the rest of the defence.

Kelly 1: Dreadful 1st half, then picked up in the 2nd. If he is not careful; the semi pros beckon for him.
Bacuna 4: Has to carry the physical threat on his own in midfield; but he is being swamped. Still the occasional brain fade.

Swift 4: Painfully slow, and kept on losing possesion. Like Kelly he has to be very careful how far down the leagues he will fall.

Meite 1: As someone said,basically a Pub player. Stam was so right to ship him to Spain, last year.

Baldock 4: Missed three half chances. Cannot play on his own up front. But we cannot play two in midfield.


Alukho 4: Tried hard,but his quality (like the team) has gone right out the window. Stepping on the ball,was really bad and summed him up.


Sims: Has to start.

Bod: Ditto

Barrow: Ditto

Ref: Usual joker;although he didnt cost us.Where do they get them from ? Booked Meite, but let a scrape on Swift go. How their CM and CF managed to escape two yellows beats me.


Clement, is probably a three nil defeat away from getting the hook.He is a clip board manager;which is not what we need. We need someone to scare the bejesus out of the players.


If Brum and Bolton each pick up minus 12, we have a chance; however there has to be someone else, and everyone looks miles better than us.I really dont know whether going down would be a disaster, or not.Probably get the same crowd in.We are now down to the tourists and ST holders.

[Victor Meldrew]

Playing Meite almost as a left-sided midfielder reminded me of when Pardew did it with Darius Henderson when the player had never played in that position before and IIRC wasn't it a play-off game away at Wolves?

Clement seems to believe that Meite can play whereas he looks as though he should be up front for a Dagenham or a Barnet.
Once again I will say nothing about Gunter.
What's the point?- Clement will still pick him and just write it off as one of those games (he is an international footballer you know).

However, persevering with Gunter, Aluko and Meite will get Clement the sack.

As for last night it has all been said and in particular what is the game plan?.
For some time, during last season as well, it has been "Give it to Mo" but if you leave him on the bench even that tactic is a non-starter.

[leon]

Ilori makes the tackle the move ends there

If midfield intercept before he gets there, illori doesn't get to make the tackle. Ends there.

It's academic anyway. We're a powderpuff team. Each player capable of weakness at any time

Agreed. That was kind of my point.

[Old Man Andrews]

OMG. That 1st half was as bad as anything Jap came up with. Then for 20 minutes we dominated, only to make a calamitous error (midfield and defence), at best naïve on that 2nd goal.
IMHO:

Walker 5: He is probably a bit thick, never knows what he is doing. But not at fault last night.

Gunter -1: Has to go and have a rethink. Totally not up for a fight. Must be someone can play LB; even if they don't cross the half way line.
Yiadom 4: Pretty good 1st half-excellent effort on goal-then his game fell apart. Back to RB.
Moore 4: Has one eye on getting away in January. Not engaged with getting us out of this.
Ilori 2: That tackle which led to the 2nd goal will live in my memory for a long time. But had no support from midfield or the rest of the defence.

Kelly 1: Dreadful 1st half, then picked up in the 2nd. If he is not careful; the semi pros beckon for him.
Bacuna 4: Has to carry the physical threat on his own in midfield; but he is being swamped. Still the occasional brain fade.

Swift 4: Painfully slow, and kept on losing possesion. Like Kelly he has to be very careful how far down the leagues he will fall.

Meite 1: As someone said,basically a Pub player. Stam was so right to ship him to Spain, last year.

Baldock 4: Missed three half chances. Cannot play on his own up front. But we cannot play two in midfield.


Alukho 4: Tried hard,but his quality (like the team) has gone right out the window. Stepping on the ball,was really bad and summed him up.


Sims: Has to start.

Bod: Ditto

Barrow: Ditto

Ref: Usual joker;although he didnt cost us.Where do they get them from ? Booked Meite, but let a scrape on Swift go. How their CM and CF managed to escape two yellows beats me.


Clement, is probably a three nil defeat away from getting the hook.He is a clip board manager;which is not what we need. We need someone to scare the bejesus out of the players.


If Brum and Bolton each pick up minus 12, we have a chance; however there has to be someone else, and everyone looks miles better than us.I really dont know whether going down would be a disaster, or not.Probably get the same crowd in.We are now down to the tourists and ST holders.

One of the all time worst posts this forum has ever seen. Congrats.

[leon]

OMG. That 1st half was as bad as anything Jap came up with. Then for 20 minutes we dominated, only to make a calamitous error (midfield and defence), at best naïve on that 2nd goal.
IMHO:

Walker 5: He is probably a bit thick, never knows what he is doing. But not at fault last night.

Gunter -1: Has to go and have a rethink. Totally not up for a fight. Must be someone can play LB; even if they don't cross the half way line.
Yiadom 4: Pretty good 1st half-excellent effort on goal-then his game fell apart. Back to RB.
Moore 4: Has one eye on getting away in January. Not engaged with getting us out of this.
Ilori 2: That tackle which led to the 2nd goal will live in my memory for a long time. But had no support from midfield or the rest of the defence.

Kelly 1: Dreadful 1st half, then picked up in the 2nd. If he is not careful; the semi pros beckon for him.
Bacuna 4: Has to carry the physical threat on his own in midfield; but he is being swamped. Still the occasional brain fade.

Swift 4: Painfully slow, and kept on losing possesion. Like Kelly he has to be very careful how far down the leagues he will fall.

Meite 1: As someone said,basically a Pub player. Stam was so right to ship him to Spain, last year.

Baldock 4: Missed three half chances. Cannot play on his own up front. But we cannot play two in midfield.


Alukho 4: Tried hard,but his quality (like the team) has gone right out the window. Stepping on the ball,was really bad and summed him up.


Sims: Has to start.

Bod: Ditto

Barrow: Ditto

Ref: Usual joker;although he didnt cost us.Where do they get them from ? Booked Meite, but let a scrape on Swift go. How their CM and CF managed to escape two yellows beats me.


Clement, is probably a three nil defeat away from getting the hook.He is a clip board manager;which is not what we need. We need someone to scare the bejesus out of the players.


If Brum and Bolton each pick up minus 12, we have a chance; however there has to be someone else, and everyone looks miles better than us.I really dont know whether going down would be a disaster, or not.Probably get the same crowd in.We are now down to the tourists and ST holders.

One of the all time worst posts this forum has ever seen. Congrats.

ooh Mr Controversial is off again.

[Theroyalbox]

[quote="Victor Meldrew"]Playing Meite almost as a left-sided midfielder reminded me of when Pardew did it with Darius Henderson when the player had never played in that position before and IIRC wasn't it a play-off game away at Wolves?

Clement seems to believe that Meite can play whereas he looks as though he should be up front for a Dagenham or a Barnet.
Once again I will say nothing about Gunter.
What's the point?- Clement will still pick him and just write it off as one of those games (he is an international footballer you know).

However, persevering with Gunter, Aluko and Meite will get Clement the sack.

As for last night it has all been said and in particular what is the game plan?.
For some time, during last season as well, it has been "Give it to Mo" but if you leave him on the bench even that tactic is a non-starter.[/quote]

Think this is where Bacuna is going wrong.

[paultheroyal]

First half so flat, dire infact. Just don't understand how you can play like that after being fired up before kick off.

Second half I actually thought we were excellent. Intent, and purpose was there. We created a fair few chances. But seriously our finishing is just woeful. What actually went against us was after scoring they were so keen to run back and kick off again they were all over the shop and forgot roles. Been far better celebrating then regrouping. That goal totally knocked the stuffing out of them.

Not a fan of Gunter bashing but accept he was very poor last night. Aluko also brings nothing to the team.

Look forward to seeing the Persian Pogba and Sims getting a start.

He looked decent when he came on.

[lightning strikes]

People talking about league one being a disaster for this club could well be right, but they better start setting their expectations now. There is no way there are three worse teams than this lot. The whole culture of the club from the top down is rotten and its directly reflected on the pitch. No skill, no tactical awareness, a lack of effort with some players, a losing mentality and no fight or grabbing games by the scruff of their necks when they are in the balance.
When we go down lets hope for a huge turnover in both playing and coaching personnel. Lets finally balance the books and silly contracts, get rid of the deadwood and lets blood the young guys and lower league players who WANT to be here to prove themselves. Yes we might not recoup much for the likes of Aluko, Gunter, Swift, llori, etc but they've shown enough in their careers at certain points that people will take their contracts off our hands, there are always panic buyers. I'd much rather watch 7 youth academy players find their feet and lose than 11 signed seasoned pros who are god awful. We're going down, start making a list of league one grounds you haven't visited and the pies you haven't tried and make peace with it.

Problem with that is Kelly is one of the most useless tossers in our team and debatably the least likeable.

Think you're on your own with this.

[Platypuss]

Moore and Illori fine, keep, good CB partnership who will improve when the team around them is better.

I thought Ilori was terrible tbh, just too weak for a CB. Moore adequate.