The On-rushing Recession and Football

[T.R.O.L.I.]

^'greed - if only for his smarmy advert on Sky to promote Rugby League just after he'd purchased London Broncos:

I liked it so much I bought the club

[Franchise FC]

The impact is starting to works it's way through to the world of football. XL has hit West Ham, AIG are in trouble which could impact Man U, the recession will hit gate receipts, TV subscription and merchandise sales. Advertising revenue will tumble as companies tighten their belts. SKY will bid significantly less for football next time around.
Which clubs are going to be in big trouble in 2 years time and how glad will we be that Reading is well run financially ?

Will West Ham survive ? Their Icelandic bank backers are in liquidation and they face a +£30m compensation bill from Sheffield United. Will they start next season with -30 points ? Are they the first major club to head into receivership ? They could start again in the Conference South as AFC West Ham United
We could be one of the richest clubs in the Prem when we go back up next year

It'll be VERY interesting to see whether the likes of West Ham are treated the same way as Bournemouth, Rotherham, and Luton.

Or maybe Kia Joorabchian will be voted onto the Board of the Premier League and the FA and miraculously, no points deduction for WHU (does that sound a little cynical ?)

[The 17 Bus]

^'greed - if only for his smarmy advert on Sky to promote Rugby League just after he'd purchased London Broncos:

I liked it so much I bought the club

Where he left within 5 years from what I can see.

i just cant see him being interested in anything long term.

[Mr Angry]

The situation with massively wealthy benefactors coming into the game is an interesting one, because as I see it, there are only 2 possible reasons for it - ego and making even more money (or both at the same time!)

The only way that there could possibly be a return on paying £30M+ on a single player (or £130M if the owners of City are to be believed) is for a world league of top teams with no relegation/promotion, with each club able to negotiate its own TV rights for either the whole season or individual games. I'm sure that Singapore TV would rather pay $200M for Real Madrid v Man Utd than $2M or even $2 for Stoke v Hull (or Reading v Watford come to that).

If this World League were to happen, then it would leave the National Leagues - including the Prem - to carry on in a more realistic economic climate.

[BR2]

On the original topic a few interesting bits of journalism have come out over the past few days.
First of all I read an article about club owners and the general theme was that they are not great businessmen at all and that generally their wealth had been attained by virtue of one business idea,lucky or otherwise and their experience in the very different world of football is almost nil.

The second article surrounded the debt of Premiership clubs where a figure was shown for each club but with very little other comment.
Man Utd for example have enormous debt but they also have:-
Stadium/land ownership
Players worth about a half of their total debt
A massive income stream from TV Revenue,gate receipts and sales of ancillaries.
This is a very successful business which could be affected by recession like any business but it would take a turn-off worldwide to football to make that happen.

The third was an interview with David Gold this morning in which he followed the above point by saying that this is one of the very few businesses where consumers pay loadsa money up front and can budget for that income-this is not the case outside of the Premier League where they rely on casual fans so lower league clubs (other than those on 2 year relegation parachute payments)will suffer much more in a recession than those in or just out of the Premier League.

As far as our club is concerned we are still in the elite and are recession-proof for at least one year,if not two if our attendances don't fall greatly next season.
The idea that because we have coined even more money by transfer sales we will be in a strong position come January for transfer purchases is theoretically sound but in practice I bet we will hear bleatings from the chairman about being in a recession,cutting cloth etc........and we will continue to be the richest club outside of The Premier League as more players are sold and we effectively give up on our chances of promotion.
Please oh Madman prove me wrong in January but if you were not prepared to improve the stadium during a healthier financial climate I can't see you pushing the boat out in January,just as no significant player investment was made last January to give us a better chance of staying up.
A part of any successful business is continued investment and speculation (amongst other things),something that no longer seems to be on the chairman's agenda.

[Royal Rother]

I bet we will hear bleatings from the chairman about being in a recession,cutting cloth etc........and we will continue to be the richest club outside of The Premier League as more players are sold and we effectively give up on our chances of promotion.

Blimey! You remind me of the old soothsayer in Up Pompeii...

[Kitsondinho]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/7659077.stm

Hahahahahahahahahahaha......just as they get tough with everything else.....never happen in a gazillion years!!

[Dirk Gently]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/7659077.stm

Hahahahahahahahahahaha......just as they get tough with everything else.....never happen in a gazillion years!!

Weren't Real Madrid in horrible amounts of debt for years (1990s)? (probably still are). Didn't hear anyone suggest that they were kicked out.

UEFA love to spout off about clubs in debt/foreign players/rich, foreign owners/racism etc but do absolutely F' all.

Perhaps that's how it's been in the past - but now the planets and personalities are aligned that a big showdown on club ownership and governence is most definitley coming.

That's why both sides are spinning like made to the press with things like this. First shots in what will be a dramatic and bloody war for control of football in Europe and the UK.

[readingbedding]

What would stop the Big clubs disconnecting with UEFA/FIFA and playing football independantly.
Like WBO and WBC in Boxing, same game, different Administrator etc.
Perhaps FIFA would go, ok you can do that, but none of your players can play for their respective National sides.

[papereyes]

Real Madrid were in debt, but to the government or something, who were never ever EVER going to call in the debt.

[Dirk Gently]

What would stop the Big clubs disconnecting with UEFA/FIFA and playing football independantly.
Like WBO and WBC in Boxing, same game, different Administrator etc.
Perhaps FIFA would go, ok you can do that, but none of your players can play for their respective National sides.

They'd only be able to play amongst themselves - so no FA/League Cups, etc in any of their home countries. They'd also have to employ their own referees as they're all under FIFA's sanction.

Also a question of whether other clubs would be allowed to trade with them.

[Dirk Gently]

Real Madrid were in debt, but to the government or something, who were never ever EVER going to call in the debt.

ISTR it was secured (on paper at least) on property which the government bought off them at a vastly unrealistic price.

[readingbedding]

What would stop the Big clubs disconnecting with UEFA/FIFA and playing football independantly.
Like WBO and WBC in Boxing, same game, different Administrator etc.
Perhaps FIFA would go, ok you can do that, but none of your players can play for their respective National sides.

They'd only be able to play amongst themselves - so no FA/League Cups, etc in any of their home countries. They'd also have to employ their own referees as they're all under FIFA's sanction.

Also a question of whether other clubs would be allowed to trade with them.

They could easliy devise their own Competitions/Cups/Leagues.
Poach Officials by paying them double etc, etc.
I reckon 12 clubs could easliy breakaway and do their own thing.

I think FIFA/UEFA is playing a dangerous game.

[papereyes]

Real Madrid were in debt, but to the government or something, who were never ever EVER going to call in the debt.

ISTR it was secured (on paper at least) on property which the government bought off them at a vastly unrealistic price.

and then built a training ground and/or stadium on, for use by Real Madrid?

[Silver Fox]

I think MAdrid sold their training ground to the government for a vast sum then leased it straight back for tuppence ha'penny

[Dirk Gently]

What would stop the Big clubs disconnecting with UEFA/FIFA and playing football independantly.
Like WBO and WBC in Boxing, same game, different Administrator etc.
Perhaps FIFA would go, ok you can do that, but none of your players can play for their respective National sides.

They'd only be able to play amongst themselves - so no FA/League Cups, etc in any of their home countries. They'd also have to employ their own referees as they're all under FIFA's sanction.

Also a question of whether other clubs would be allowed to trade with them.

They could easliy devise their own Competitions/Cups/Leagues.
Poach Officials by paying them double etc, etc.
I reckon 12 clubs could easliy breakaway and do their own thing.

I think FIFA/UEFA is playing a dangerous game.

Maybe, and that's what this is all about. But never forget thatthe big difference between teh two organisations is that UEFA isn't a governing body - only the FA & FIFA are that. UEFA is in the middle as a confederation which runs local competitions - with afairly tenuous status - which they'd like to change. But the whole world of football poitics is damn complicated.

But if there is a breakaway how long would it last?
How long would a competition between the same 12 or 16 clubs hold the public's attention?
Would the value of the TV contracts hold up after the initial launch?
And would the footall clubs left behind in each of the countries be better off without the big clubs who are massively distorting the financial structure and the competitions? They'd have less TV money but a much more level playing field.

I don't pretend know the answers to those questions but a lot of people in football think they do. But the day of judgement is rapidly approaching.

[papereyes]

How long would a competition between the same 12 or 16 clubs hold the public's attention?

My thoughts on this are - the old school 'real' fans would hate it but a world-wide audience would eat up a 16 team super league.

Even more so if it was open to expansion of franchises from South America etc.

I also think that might be where global football is headed.

[Dirk Gently]

How long would a competition between the same 12 or 16 clubs hold the public's attention?

My thoughts on this are - the old school 'real' fans would hate it but a world-wide audience would eat up a 16 team super league.

Even more so if it was open to expansion of franchises from South America etc.

I also think that might be where global football is headed.

Maybe - but the strategy of the big clubs is to go global themselves with franchises - so effectively there'd be a "Manchester Utd", a "Barcelona", a "Real Madrid" and so on playing on each continent.

[readingbedding]

There would be no going back, if Manchester United left the FA Football Pyramid, the door would be closed to them - certainly if they wanted to rejoin the League where they left it at a later date.

The Nike Cup/Challenge/Championship sounds neat.
The biggest sides from each Continent playing each other home and away in a League and as a one-off in Cups.