Craig Bellamy

[Y21_Royal]

http://hobnob.royals.org/forum/viewtopi ... &sk=t&sd=a

[PEARCEY]

I say this with no real basis (but since when does that stop anyone on here) but is it possible that Cardiff manage to get round some of these rules because their transfers have to go through the Welsh FA? I remember a case a few years ago, Simon Wharton I think it was, was banned from playing for a few games because he did not recieve international clearance for his move from Cardiff to Leeds.

If this is still the case then this could be another example of the Welsh FA turning a blind eye or being ridiculously lenient with Cardiff City

I don't think thats right. I thought that for all matters relating to transfers they still had to go through the FA and not the FAW.

[PEARCEY]

Motherwell are fully justified to be pissed off.
Apparently Gethin Jenkins, Cardiff City Director, has confirmed the debt will be paid within the next 7 days.

[Y21_Royal]

I say this with no real basis (but since when does that stop anyone on here) but is it possible that Cardiff manage to get round some of these rules because their transfers have to go through the Welsh FA? I remember a case a few years ago, Simon Wharton I think it was, was banned from playing for a few games because he did not recieve international clearance for his move from Cardiff to Leeds.

If this is still the case then this could be another example of the Welsh FA turning a blind eye or being ridiculously lenient with Cardiff City

I don't think thats right. I thought that for all matters relating to transfers they still had to go through the FA and not the FAW.

That may well be the case now. As I said, its only really a fairly baseless theory but would answer a few questions

[PEARCEY]

What exactly has he done that Mancini wants nothing to do with him?

Apparently they argued over Bellamy doing a full training programme. Bellamy has dodgy knees and under Mark Hughes did a lesser training schedule. Mancini wanted him to do the same training as his colleagues and they fell out.
Bellamy apparently also hi-fived Harry Redknapp the night Spurs beat Man City which played a key part in their finishing 4th. This action probably didn't go down well with Mancini.

[papereyes]

You would have thought that one of the threads concerning Craig Bellamy may have contained this story.

[rhroyal]

I have a massive rant to get off my chest after today's news. Here it is:

WHAT THE F*CK?!?!?! Am I right in thinking that Cardiff have already faced a winding up order from the taxman? And they have recently had a transfer embargo due to debt. Yet, they have this summer signed Jason Koumas, Seyi Olofinjana and now, maddest of all, Craig Bellamy. Have they even sold many stars? Make no mistake, that squad will be a big threat to this division. I imagine they must still be paying off the new stadium too.

And now this revelation from Motherwell. Good on them chasing it up. I hope Cardiff pay for this. I hope they've taken the debt beyond manageable levels and when they get found out, they go to the wall and get left hung our to dry for all to see. It's hard enough to climb out of this division when there are bigger clubs with larger fan bases and hence larger resources. There are also clubs legitimately financed by sugar daddies such as Nottm Forest, Ipswich and QPR. It'll be difficult to win promotion without facing clubs who are cheating their way out. Cheating is exactly what they're doing.

Football needs an example. It should have been Pompey, they were so high profile everybody would have noticed. They overspent for years. If they stay up this season, as I think they will, they'll be back to square 1 ten years later. After an FA cup, European football and several seasons in the top flight. I think the Pompey example has shown that it pays to cheat in this way.

Enough. Liquidate somebody. Show the whole world what happens if you go beyond your means. People say it's unfair on the fans.

Parents are allowed to be driven to bankruptcy by the law; is that fair on their children? If yes, it's perfectly fair for football fans to lose their team. Somebody has to pay properly for overspending and I will be royally pissed off and disillusioned with the system if Cardiff end up in the Premiership at the end of the season. They have cheated.

[pea]

Its an absolute disgrace, but is anyone surprised, they keep letting clubs get away with it so clubs will keep doing it. I couldn't believe Hull were allowed to sign Robert Koren on £15k a week when they can't even pay us for debts from over a year ago.

[handbags_harris]

What portion? And can it be right for the richest club in Britain to subsidise one of our rivals?

You mean like Chelsea and Blackburn subsidised us last season?

Indeed. We can hardly complain when our clubs survival in the Championship hinged upon three Premiership loan signings.

And our mere survival in the Championship was partly because RFC tries to live within it's means. Yes, three Premier League loanees came in, but do you really think that Ryan Bertrand, Andy Griffin, and Zurab Khizanishvili were on £95k a week subsidised by their parent clubs for the duration of their loans? Massive massive difference in circumstances old boy - we could afford the loanees. It is apparent that Cardiff can't, yet I'll bet every penny I own that they'll somehow get around this.

[Hoop Blah]

I bet every penny you own that we couldn't have afforded those premiership players without their parent club picking up a fairly decent percentage of their wages.

The numbers might be different, but the principal is exactly the same.

[6ft Kerplunk]

No it isn't. We didn't have outstanding debts to other clubs that we were refusing to pay. We also probably keep up to date with our tax bill too even if we are underwritten to some extent by Madejski.

[PEARCEY]

I wish you wouldn't refer to me as old boy all the time Handbags. I will call you young girl if you persist.
I'm with HB on this. Its the same principal. From what I gather Man City are paying most of Bellamy's wages so what Cardiff are paying is not that much...plus they will more than recoup that cost in extra bums on seat, merchandise etc. The deal makes sense from their point of view. As HB says its likely that Griff, Kish and Bertrand's wages were, in part, paid by their parent clubs especially given that Rodgers appears to have been told pre-Christmas there were no funds available for new purchases. In the circs both Griff and Kish deals would have involved us only paying part of their wages.

[handbags_harris]

I bet every penny you own that we couldn't have afforded those premiership players without their parent club picking up a fairly decent percentage of their wages.

The numbers might be different, but the principal is exactly the same.

I'm fully aware of the principles, but surely the completely different financial demographics of both clubs cannot have failed to escape your attention? The fact is that despite not being able to afford the wages outright, Reading FC is a financially sound establishment that could afford to take a calculated risk with said players. Cardiff City on the other hand, is not and the recent transfer embargos alongside the winding up orders from the HMRC are a huge testament to that. Cardiff couldn't afford to pay their players (the majority of whom are still at the club with the new additions) at times last season and had to lie to fans in order to get them to purchase early season tickets to raise £3 million for "squad strengthening". Funny that they owed £2.8 million in unpaid tax at that time. Did RFC have to resort to those measures? Has it ever had to resort to those measures?

Or to put it another way - affordable signings vs unaffordable signings. Simple really.

[PEARCEY]

No it isn't. We didn't have outstanding debts to other clubs that we were refusing to pay. We also probably keep up to date with our tax bill too even if we are underwritten to some extent by Madejski.

Yes fair point.....particularly given Motherwell are a small club. Cardiff are apparently paying this within 7 days but it shouldn't need being dragged into Court to pay for the Quinn signing. The trouble is Cardiff are playing the game and using the rules to suit their interests. Perhaps as a club we play it too straight because you can bet your bottom dollar Cardiff as many others have done will somehow still continue to trade.....they are not breaking the rules though....the rules do need to be changed to avoid this being allowed to happen.

[handbags_harris]

they are not breaking the rules though....the rules do need to be changed to avoid this being allowed to happen.

Yes they are. They agree a transfer fee with another club to sign a player, agree terms with the player and therefore sign him from the other club, and then fail to pay the transfer fee. When clubs agree a transfer fee they are contractually agree to specific financial arrangements in the event that the transfer occurs. They are therefore obliged both by FA regulations andby contractual law to adhere to the agreement.

What I think you mean is that the punishments for not paying transfer fees needs to be much more stringent, a point to which I entirely agree.

[Dirk Gently]

I have a massive rant to get off my chest after today's news. Here it is:
.....

This is part of the ludicrous situation with football - if you're going to go bust, you might as well go bust BIG!

For a club chasing promotion from Tier 2, or trying to avoid relegation in Tier 1, the fact is that once you’ve spent a certain amount you’re completely stuffed if you fail to go up/stay up. And once you recognise that, there’s little real difference in spending £2M you haven’t got and spending £20M or £50M you haven’t got – the end result is the same, except that the more you spend the greater your changes of going u or staying and so living to fight another day.

It’s utterly ridiculous, and again it comes back to the fact that the only clubs who are punished are those who have gambled and failed – we need a system of financial monitoring so that clubs can be stopped from gambling, not just dealt with once the damage has been done.

[Ian Royal]

I'd add that there is a tad of difference between a completely unproven youngster (at that level) and two veterans at weaker sides who aren't being picked, going to a stable championship club. Certainly when compared to a proven Premier League striker that half the clubs at that level would likely have been quite happy to take on, who's wage is about 9 times the championship average, going to a club in severe financial difficulties.

[Very near...far away]

BTW: Craig Bellamy is one of the snidiest players in football. On last season's form he's too good for this league though. Whether he can repeat that form for Cardiff on a regular basis is another matter. He will get sent off in his first three games for them (if he's not crocked before then).

[handbags_harris]

Chopra, Bothroyd, and now Bellamy. A forward line of absolute oxf*rd.

[Whore Jackie]

Chopra, Bothroyd, and now Bellamy. A forward line of absolute oxf*rd.

Top drawer though, better than a few Premier League teams.