Greatest club football team of all time

[Terminal Boardom]

Back to the OP, were Brazil 1970 really the best? I would have thought that Hungary in the early 1950s would have been more than a contender. The only reason they lost the 1954 WCF to Germany was because the Germans cheated.

As for club football, it really is a tough call but I would have to plump for Athletico Whaddon managed by the immortal Les Bence.

[bobbybottler]

As for club football, it really is a tough call but I would have to plump for Athletico Whaddon managed by the immortal Les Bence.

[Svlad Cjelli]

Back to the OP, were Brazil 1970 really the best? I would have thought that Hungary in the early 1950s would have been more than a contender. The only reason they lost the 1954 WCF to Germany was because the Germans cheated.

The fact that they're so highly regarded is really just a question of timing. They were winners of the last world cup before "pressing" became the tactical fashion everywhere, so while they had lots of time on the ball without being closed down (as had been usual in the game for the last 100 years) they also had the good fortune to be winners of teh first world cup to be televised globally and in colour. They did what many others had done before in one way or another but no-one had really seen.

[papereyes]

...included two serious contenders in the “best player of all-time” nonsense debate in Di Stefano and Puskas.

Puskas was a fat bloke with a great left foot. It could be argued that he wouldn't cut it in the modern game, but then who's to say that if he were playing now he wouldn't be fitter and more athletic?

The point is that it's impossible to compare different generations as the game has evolved so much and the physical demands are more extreme. The flipside is that great players used to be able to get away with having a skinful before a game whereas it's far stricter these days and they wouldn't get away with doing so.

The pull back goal in the famous Hungarian win over England ("like a fire engine going to the wrong fire") remains one of my all-time favourite goals.

That amount of awareness and skill in a confined space would still be there - there is NO doubt in my mind that players would have adapted.

[Y21_Royal]

I've always found this conversation a little pointless. International sides have a distinct advantage of only being judged over a few games ie, play brilliantly for half a dozen games at a WC and you're described as the best ever, club sides don't have that luxury. Perhaps because of that sides like Puskas' Hungary and Pele's Brazil carry a mysticism about them and aren't analysed to the degree modern sides are. To that end I think you have to make a distinction between greatest club and greatest national side.

To my mind this current Barcelona side is as close to greatness as I've ever seen from a club side, could they beat Sacchi's Milan, Cryuff's Ajax or Di Stefano's Real Madrid, who knows?

[bobbybottler]

I've always found this conversation a little pointless. International sides have a distinct advantage of only being judged over a few games ie, play brilliantly for half a dozen games at a WC and you're described as the best ever, club sides don't have that luxury. Perhaps because of that sides like Puskas' Hungary and Pele's Brazil carry a mysticism about them and aren't analysed to the degree modern sides are. To that end I think you have to make a distinction between greatest club and greatest national side.

To my mind this current Barcelona side is as close to greatness as I've ever seen from a club side, could they beat Sacchi's Milan, Cryuff's Ajax or Di Stefano's Real Madrid, who knows?

Despite winning the European Cup three times in a row, Cruyff's Ajax were far from dominant in Holland - between 1968 and 1974 they won Eredivisie three times, as did Feyenoord.

I'd argue that being "Greatest club football team of all time" necessit8ed domestic dominance.

[Barry the bird boggler]

I've always found this conversation a little pointless. International sides have a distinct advantage of only being judged over a few games ie, play brilliantly for half a dozen games at a WC and you're described as the best ever, club sides don't have that luxury. Perhaps because of that sides like Puskas' Hungary and Pele's Brazil carry a mysticism about them and aren't analysed to the degree modern sides are. To that end I think you have to make a distinction between greatest club and greatest national side.

To my mind this current Barcelona side is as close to greatness as I've ever seen from a club side, could they beat Sacchi's Milan, Cryuff's Ajax or Di Stefano's Real Madrid, who knows?

Despite winning the European Cup three times in a row, Cruyff's Ajax were far from dominant in Holland - between 1968 and 1974 they won Eredivisie three times, as did Feyenoord.

I'd argue that being "Greatest club football team of all time" necessit8ed domestic dominance.

So it has to be Rangers or Celtic then....

[Svlad Cjelli]

We're onto the old question of success vs style/beauty.

To be great isn't necessarily about winning .....

And at this juncture can I re-recommend this :

[papereyes]

That's well worth a read.

His new book is pretty ace as well.

[bobbybottler]

We're onto the old question of success vs style/beauty.

To be great isn't necessarily about winning .....

And at this juncture can I re-recommend this :

No, but advances in tactics aren't going to be well received without winning something.

[Y21_Royal]

Very good book

Also begs the question of whether a side like Lobanovski's Dinamo Kiev is greater than say Cryuff's Ajax because they invented an entirely new way of playing and the other copied it. In that regard I come back again to the current Barca side...