Generic clubs in financial crisis Thread

[Sutekh]

This. Everton have chosen a great season for the punishments because the 3 promoted teams are so poor and Dyche is a good manager. Any of the last 2 seasons, this would have been fatal.

PL have set a precedent here though. The City case is bigger and more complicated. If they get off lightly at the end of it, the PL will need to explain why.

City will get off scot free. It will have nothing to do with justice, fairness or legality but everything to do with money, power and influence, of which the owners have an almost unlimited supply.

There is an independent commission who publish their rulings. If City get off, the reasoning has to stand up to public scrutiny.

What gets me is how the PL have let City's offences rack up year on year for almost a decade before taking any interest. I'd be looking to fine/sanction them just for being in a state where so many charges could be levied let alone whether they're actually guilty of any or not.

[Sutekh]

Everton docked 10 points

Opens the door for Burnley, Leeds and Leicester to sue Everton for relegation damages.

People always say this will happen when someone gets a deduction and as yet nothing has happened, probably because it's going to be impossible to prove they'd have stayed up without whatever the offending club doing what they did

Didn't Wycombe try it on against Derby and fail, though they may have got some financial reward?

Most obvious success in the courts, though for totally different offences, was over the behaviour of West Ham in the signing of Tevez. The PL totally failed their members on that occasion (wonder if it had been a smaller "name" they'd have done the same thing).

[ayjaydee]

A couple of snippets

From the independent commission

Phillips said he was "satisfied that the applicant clubs have potential claims for compensation" - but noted the commission holds no "inherent jurisdiction" and it is instead "the role of the Premier League to bring and prosecute complaints"

From the BBC

Everton advanced six mitigating factors in their defence. Among them, the club maintains they were entitled to credit for not pursuing a financial claim against 'Player X' - a decision they say was taken out of concern for the player's psychological wellbeing after he had been arrested.

[WestYorksRoyal]

I do wonder if the PL have created a rod for their own back here. Everton broke the rules, but they cooperated. 10 points feels steep.

Compare this with City and Chelsea for both of whom this is yet to come to a head. They have systematics found loopholes, covered up and made a mockery of the rules for overall decade. If Everton's punishment is 10 points, what is fair for those two? Expulsions? Imagine the fall out from that; PL would be sued for obscene amounts.

[Sutekh]

I do wonder if the PL have created a rod for their own back here. Everton broke the rules, but they cooperated. 10 points feels steep.

Compare this with City and Chelsea for both of whom this is yet to come to a head. They have systematics found loopholes, covered up and made a mockery of the rules for overall decade. If Everton's punishment is 10 points, what is fair for those two? Expulsions? Imagine the fall out from that; PL would be sued for obscene amounts.

Everton will appeal and it'll probably be reduced. The PL have come down hard as they want to make it abundantly clear to one and all that transgressions will be be punished whatever the name and history of the offending club is.

Chelsea may get a little leeway as they've apparently admitted to naughties and are working with the PL to mitigate any punishments. Man City though are moaning and complaining about it all and the size of their mess could mean another 3 or 4 years before it all gets figured out (and hopefully not dropped for just being to difficult to wade through).

Member clubs apparently voted for quick turnaround on future naughties in the summer so if the published accounts for PL clubs due before xmas reveal any other shenanigans then other clubs could be losing points before the end of the season.

[Stranded]

I do wonder if the PL have created a rod for their own back here. Everton broke the rules, but they cooperated. 10 points feels steep.

Compare this with City and Chelsea for both of whom this is yet to come to a head. They have systematics found loopholes, covered up and made a mockery of the rules for overall decade. If Everton's punishment is 10 points, what is fair for those two? Expulsions? Imagine the fall out from that; PL would be sued for obscene amounts.

As with the EFL, the punishment has not been decided by the PL but an independent panel.

[Sutekh]

I do wonder if the PL have created a rod for their own back here. Everton broke the rules, but they cooperated. 10 points feels steep.

Compare this with City and Chelsea for both of whom this is yet to come to a head. They have systematics found loopholes, covered up and made a mockery of the rules for overall decade. If Everton's punishment is 10 points, what is fair for those two? Expulsions? Imagine the fall out from that; PL would be sued for obscene amounts.

As with the EFL, the punishment has not been decided by the PL but an independent panel.

I see lots are up in arms about poor little Everton getting points knocked off yet no-one gives a **** when it's a FL club.

[Franchise FC]

I do wonder if the PL have created a rod for their own back here. Everton broke the rules, but they cooperated. 10 points feels steep.

Compare this with City and Chelsea for both of whom this is yet to come to a head. They have systematics found loopholes, covered up and made a mockery of the rules for overall decade. If Everton's punishment is 10 points, what is fair for those two? Expulsions? Imagine the fall out from that; PL would be sued for obscene amounts.

As with the EFL, the punishment has not been decided by the PL but an independent panel.

I see lots are up in arms about poor little Everton getting points knocked off yet no-one gives a **** when it's a FL club.

Perhaps there are more Everton supporters than Reading supporters

[BRO_BOT]

There may have to be an amnesty for football clubs' dodgy dealings

I think they've all been at it, dodgy payments to agents etc

[Sutekh]

There may have to be an amnesty for football clubs' dodgy dealings

I think they've all been at it, dodgy payments to agents etc

Can't do that, those clubs caught out and not amnestied in the years/months beforehand would be screaming blue murder and threatening legal action. The FL and PL have to ensure integrity is maintained and that every club caught out is suitably done over.

[BRO_BOT]

There may have to be an amnesty for football clubs' dodgy dealings

I think they've all been at it, dodgy payments to agents etc

Can't do that, those clubs caught out and not amnestied in the years/months beforehand would be screaming blue murder and threatening legal action. The FL and PL have to ensure integrity is maintained and that every club caught out is suitably done over.

I just think there are going to be too many clubs involved

[From Despair To Where?]

I do wonder if the PL have created a rod for their own back here. Everton broke the rules, but they cooperated. 10 points feels steep.

Compare this with City and Chelsea for both of whom this is yet to come to a head. They have systematics found loopholes, covered up and made a mockery of the rules for overall decade. If Everton's punishment is 10 points, what is fair for those two? Expulsions? Imagine the fall out from that; PL would be sued for obscene amounts.

As with the EFL, the punishment has not been decided by the PL but an independent panel.

I see lots are up in arms about poor little Everton getting points knocked off yet no-one gives a **** when it's a FL club.

I don't think it's "poor little Everton" as much as "watch Citeh and Chelsea get away with it"

I reckon Citeh will be stripped of titles and not a lot else. Chelsea will have a 2 window transfer embargo imposed.

[Stranded]

There may have to be an amnesty for football clubs' dodgy dealings

I think they've all been at it, dodgy payments to agents etc

Can't do that, those clubs caught out and not amnestied in the years/months beforehand would be screaming blue murder and threatening legal action. The FL and PL have to ensure integrity is maintained and that every club caught out is suitably done over.

I just think there are going to be too many clubs involved

So what, if it means that a raft of big clubs get massive fines/point deductions/relegations and clubs who are being run properly get to take their place then so be it.

Unfortunately, the PL know that their product relies on the "Big 6" clubs to drive revenues, any one underneath that is essentially collaterol. So whilst I anticipate many more penalties for clubs, it will be very interesting* to see how that compares to penalties given to City, Chelsea or any of Arsenal, Spurs, Liverpool and United if they were to ever be found in breach.

[6ft Kerplunk]

Have Everton been accumulating debt while City and Chelsea have ridiculously wealthy owners willing to spunk their money without burdening the club with the debt?

[Sutekh]

Nice to see Everton fans being so accepting of Everton's penalty. Jeez! They've even raised £40000 to fund protests against the PL

Demo in London on Friday, flying a plane over the City v Liverpool game and "red card" shenanigans when Everton take on Utd on Sunday.

Some people ought get a perspective on life!

[From Despair To Where?]

Have Everton been accumulating debt while City and Chelsea have ridiculously wealthy owners willing to spunk their money without burdening the club with the debt?

It's about breaches of regulations though, and City have been charged with something like 115 of them.

[Franchise FC]

Have Everton been accumulating debt while City and Chelsea have ridiculously wealthy owners willing to spunk their money without burdening the club with the debt?

It's about breaches of regulations though, and City have been charged with something like 115 of them.

I obviously don't know for sure as I have no inside knowledge, but isn't the difference that Everton accepted that they'd racked up the debt whereas City have been treating some/all funds from the Saudis as sponsorship income, therefore NOT racking up the debt.

It might be viewed as semantics but could be why there's a difference in the PL approach

[Dirk Gently]

Have Everton been accumulating debt while City and Chelsea have ridiculously wealthy owners willing to spunk their money without burdening the club with the debt?

It's about breaches of regulations though, and City have been charged with something like 115 of them.

I obviously don't know for sure as I have no inside knowledge, but isn't the difference that Everton accepted that they'd racked up the debt whereas City have been treating some/all funds from the Saudis as sponsorship income, therefore NOT racking up the debt.

It might be viewed as semantics but could be why there's a difference in the PL approach

I think a lot of it is the complexity. Everton have accepted the charges and they're all fairly cut and dried. The Man City charges are much more complex, and based on semantics and interpretations of regulations. Most importantly, though, City will dispute every single one and there's going to be a whole army of expensive lawyers and forensic accountants getting rich before this ever gets resolved.

[Uke]

Have Everton been accumulating debt while City and Chelsea have ridiculously wealthy owners willing to spunk their money without burdening the club with the debt?

It's about breaches of regulations though, and City have been charged with something like 115 of them.

I obviously don't know for sure as I have no inside knowledge, but isn't the difference that Everton accepted that they'd racked up the debt whereas City have been treating some/all funds from the Saudis as sponsorship income, therefore NOT racking up the debt.

It might be viewed as semantics but could be why there's a difference in the PL approach

I'm anti-semantic when it comes to football finances

[Franchise FC]

It's about breaches of regulations though, and City have been charged with something like 115 of them.

I obviously don't know for sure as I have no inside knowledge, but isn't the difference that Everton accepted that they'd racked up the debt whereas City have been treating some/all funds from the Saudis as sponsorship income, therefore NOT racking up the debt.

It might be viewed as semantics but could be why there's a difference in the PL approach

I'm anti-semantic when it comes to football finances

As long as everyone pays what is due