Racism in football (John Terry spin-off)

[Platypuss]

Didn't stop Redknapp.

[Hoop Blah]

Isn't this the same phenomenon that means there are very few black quarter-backs in American football - an assumption/stereotype that whilst black people are fast and strong, and so good enough to play in certain positions, they're not "clever" enough for certain roles where you need brains rather than muscle and speed?

For quarter-backs in the US, read managers here.

Possibly, although I think it may be more about the ability/desire for certain individuals to be make the right connections within the game as players that then serve them well when looking for post-playing roles.

Adie Williams, Phil Parkinson and Murty all seemed to be quite good at pallying up to Madejski and Hammond and so could probably find themselves on a short list for a managers job more easily than Keith McPherson, Floyd Street or Martin Williams.

That's not to say that Jason Roberts isn't going to leave a better impression than Noel Hunt!

I do think the argument that minorities aren't actually under represented is quite an interesting one, and one that never seems to get any airtime/column inches when this topic comes up in the media.

A point I made the other day is that the majority of managers have played over here for sometime and are presumably well connected in the industry because of it. There is presumably a higher percentage of black players who aren't here for the long haul and so don't hang around after their playing career or build up those industry wide connections (that assumption is questionable though I think).

[Alexander Litvinenko]

At this point I would like to call a Mr Ron Atkinson as a witness to the way many in football regard black players.

[Hoop Blah]

At this point I would like to call a Mr Ron Atkinson as a witness to the way many in football regard black players.

To an extent perhaps yes, but I think that's quite an outdated view and stereotype to be honest. 20 years ago I'd have said his would've been a more prevalent viewpoint.

Don't forget that it's almost 15 years since he had a job in football and a lot's changed in that time.

Obviously there will still be some racists attitudes in football, it is afterall just another industry in society and so reflects that society, but I don't think Big Ron's type really hold much influence these days (at least comparitively).

[creative_username_1]

At this point I would like to call a Mr Ron Atkinson as a witness to the way many in football regard black players.

He did bring a lot of black players through at WBA and took some of them with him when he went to Utd tbf

[Alexander Litvinenko]

At this point I would like to call a Mr Ron Atkinson as a witness to the way many in football regard black players.

To an extent perhaps yes, but I think that's quite an outdated view and stereotype to be honest. 20 years ago I'd have said his would've been a more prevalent viewpoint.

Don't forget that it's almost 15 years since he had a job in football and a lot's changed in that time.

Obviously there will still be some racists attitudes in football, it is afterall just another industry in society and so reflects that society, but I don't think Big Ron's type really hold much influence these days (at least comparitively).

Yes, but in many ways football is slower to change than society in general. It's very insular and very set in its ways.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

At this point I would like to call a Mr Ron Atkinson as a witness to the way many in football regard black players.

He did bring a lot of black players through at WBA and took some of them with him when he went to Utd tbf

Yes, but only as players. He had clear views on what they could and couldn't do.

[Hoop Blah]

Yes, but in many ways football is slower to change than society in general. It's very insular and very set in its ways.

Addressing racism isn't one of those ways though is it?

[Alexander Litvinenko]

Yes, but in many ways football is slower to change than society in general. It's very insular and very set in its ways.

Addressing racism isn't one of those ways though is it?

Yes, I think it is. It gives money to programmes like SRTRC & Kick It Out so it ticks the required boxes of being seen to be doing something, but the attitudes of many of those who control the game are still very old-fashioned.

[Hoop Blah]

But in terms of accepting minorities and taking steps to integrate them it's not behind the times is it?

Some people with influence will still be old fashioned yes, probably a function of them having to work their way up the ladder and so being 'old'. But is that any worse than in other industries such as banking or manufacturing?

It'd be interesting to see the same stats that are used to beat up football for some other industries as a comparison.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

But in terms of accepting minorities and taking steps to integrate them it's not behind the times is it?

Some people with influence will still be old fashioned yes, probably a function of them having to work their way up the ladder and so being 'old'. But is that any worse than in other industries such as banking or manufacturing?

It'd be interesting to see the same stats that are used to beat up football for some other industries as a comparison.

Depends what you mean by "integrate."

Yes, they'll employ black players because they tend to win matches, and they'll advertise to minorities to try and get them to buy tickets for matches.

But taking steps to properly integrate them at all levels and at all functions of the game? No way!

[Hoop Blah]

But isn't one of the points made on this thread that those minorities are represented in a reasonable proportion?

2.5% of league managers are from an ethnic minority. Wasn't it said that that's a proportionate number*?

Owners are probably in the same ballpark aren't they?

* I'm accepting here that the figures mentioned earlier in the thread are roughly correct. That might be a bit stupid of me of course!

[Alexander Litvinenko]

Players are massively over-represented and have been since the 80s - and the number of managers is very low in comparison to the number of players. As the majority of managers are ex-players this suggests they're not getting opportunities.

[ZacNaloen]

Wtf has just happened in serbia

[TheMaraudingDog]

Players are massively over-represented and have been since the 80s - and the number of managers is very low in comparison to the number of players. As the majority of managers are ex-players this suggests they're not getting opportunities.

No it doesn't.

[Zaretsky]

Wtf has just happened in serbia

Dunno, trying to find out.

[winchester_royal]

Vile scenes in Serbia as the U21's win out there.

Racial abuse, Serbian players attacking England staff, missiles being chucked at the English players, all sorts.

Chuck 'em out Fifa.

[Zaretsky]

UEFA but still

[creative_username_1]

http://www.101greatgoals.com/gvideos/co ... erbia-u21/

[winchester_royal]

UEFA but still

Fifa world cup m8