BFTG-Bristol city.

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Kitsondinho
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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by Kitsondinho » 27 Nov 2016 09:12

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Kitsondinho If it isn't a dive, it certainly isn't a foul. We'd (rightly) be furious if one was given against us like that. The touch on Samuel is minimal at best.....


Lee Johnson's view as the Bristol City manager was “It was two players running for the ball, the striker’s legs get tangled up as he cuts across the defender and falls over. No complaints, yet it’s a penalty." So I think that it isn't a dive, Samuel got caught up with the defender or lost his footing and tumbled down, there certainly didn't appear to be a reaction from him or anyone appealing for a penalty.

Given the split second the officials have to make a decision the linesman thought he saw Magnusson clip Samuel's heels either deliberately or accidentally. Harsh decision I think but it's one of those things we've had given against us down the years as much as Bristol City would have benefitted from. And yet it's one of the best things about the game, human error, was it/wasn't it? The day that things like that get taken away and replaced by video technology is the day the game should be packed in.

Samuel is all about speed and has a lightweight presence in my opinion, and when running at full pelt I don't think it would be too difficult to "dislodge" him. That is a part of his game he needs to work on otherwise he's going to get a lot of attention from referees and fans for perceived diving - which may or may not be warranted.

Question. If Kermorgant is fit next week would you start with him or Samuel?

Agree with all that. I'm not sure it was a dive, but it wasn't a foul. As you say, our appeal for a pen was non existent. It wasn't a pen, but (like you) I can see why it was given.

Despite all that, I'd personally give Samuel a start next week at Fulham. He has played well in his last two starts and has been involved in a few chances and obviously scored last week and 'won' :wink: the pen yesterday.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by Snowball » 27 Nov 2016 09:15

windermere_royal Seemed to follow the same pattern of a few of our home games this season. looked good in the first half with players looking comfotable on the ball. second half made it difficult for ourselves. BC can probably be justified in feeling hard done by. 25 efforts on goal with only 7 on target. i guess they only have themselves to blame for not getting something from the game.
debatable pen from where i was sitting, bit the lino was alot closer to make the call. and THAT save from AHH. probably deserved the half time two goal margin.

PS, please take Garath off pens, i had a fiver on Williams to score the first goal...


Please keep Garath on pens. After pocketing £800 last week I had Garath FG and 2-0 or 3-0 (miss) but persuaded the GF to have a £10 "saver" on Garath FG 2-1 (£600)

She now thinks we can give up work and just bet on games. That was the first bet she'd ever made.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by taipairoyal » 27 Nov 2016 09:25

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Bloody hell. I hate this sort of stuff... that's a dive and no excuses.[/quote]


He obviously has been watching Rakels.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by sandman » 27 Nov 2016 09:28

Unusual for you to be up this early on a Sunday, kes.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by RoyalBlue » 27 Nov 2016 09:40

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Please enlighten us to what he actually did wrong?. I thought he was one of the better refs we will see this season.


Waved away the penalty for starters - thank goodness for Bristol City's favourite Assistant Ref!

Waved advantage when one of just two players we had breaking forward was flattened and left on the ground leaving the other player to take on three defenders on his own!

Being balanced, missed a clear handball in our area by one of our players in the first half. Let AH get away with murder in terms of holding ball in hands and general time wasting.


He didn't wave away penalty. He waited and waited and the assistant signalled so you got that wrong.

He correctly called advantage when fouled (not flattened) and at time we were only facing one defender but we slowed the move down so can't blame referee for that. So you got that wrong.

Not aware of any handball blatant in first half and as Habsi was warned about time wasting and then pretty much sped up within reason... so you got that wrong too.

So yeah, abysmal ref!


So unless we get full replay we can't be which of us is correct as to whether ref dismissed penalty or waited. In my view he wasn't even looking at Assistant immediately after.

We clearly aren't talking about the same incident re our man being flattened. At the moment that happened there were two defenders covering our player the ball went to plus covering defender. We had no others forward. So how is that advantage? And if our player did then hold up play he had no option!

Our defender got ball caught on his hand just inside area, controlled and was able to clear. We would have been livid had we been denied penalty in similar circumstances.

AH pretty much sped up?!You are joking. Again we would have been livid if boot was on other foot. And prior to that he had stood/ wandered with ball in hands for at least 10 seconds. City fans were screaming for ref to take action and some of us were also screaming for him to release ball before he was penalised.

And I didn't say ref was abysmal. I responded to your question as to what he did wrong!


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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by SCIAG » 27 Nov 2016 10:01

Kitsondinho If it isn't a dive, it certainly isn't a foul. We'd (rightly) be furious if one was given against us like that. The touch on Samuel is minimal at best.....

If it isn't a dive, it has to be a penalty. Tripping an opponent is a foul, and there's no need for there to be any intent.

The only other possibility is that Samuel just happened to fall over as he crossed paths with the defender, which seems very unlikely.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by Muskrat » 27 Nov 2016 10:32

50/50 decision. Seen them given, seen them waived away. Today we benefited, another day we'll have given against us.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by genome » 27 Nov 2016 10:49

SCIAG
Kitsondinho If it isn't a dive, it certainly isn't a foul. We'd (rightly) be furious if one was given against us like that. The touch on Samuel is minimal at best.....

If it isn't a dive, it has to be a penalty. Tripping an opponent is a foul, and there's no need for there to be any intent.

The only other possibility is that Samuel just happened to fall over as he crossed paths with the defender, which seems very unlikely.


I think that's exactly what happened. The Brizzle defender is just running forward after the ball, and Samuel cuts across him and gets his legs clipped and decides to go down.

I'm not complaining like, but it's not a penalty.

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Ian Royal
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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by Ian Royal » 27 Nov 2016 10:59

SCIAG
Kitsondinho If it isn't a dive, it certainly isn't a foul. We'd (rightly) be furious if one was given against us like that. The touch on Samuel is minimal at best.....

If it isn't a dive, it has to be a penalty. Tripping an opponent is a foul, and there's no need for there to be any intent.

The only other possibility is that Samuel just happened to fall over as he crossed paths with the defender, which seems very unlikely.

Looked like a bit of an arm on him, then a nick to a leg as they're crossing, but nothing like enough to actually seriously impede him... Then Samuel does a fake trip as if his back leg's been held and throws himself down.

It's not a total dive with no contact at all, but there's no significant imediment for me and a deliberate choice to make it appear there was and go down.

I don't like it and never have, but it's pretty common.


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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by LWJ » 27 Nov 2016 11:03

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IMO was a lot clearer from the East. Obviously catches his heel.

I don't think it was on purpose, but would expect them to be given against us as well as it's impeded an attacking opportunity. Indirect FK might be more appropriate though? I class it in the same category of handball's in the box, they aren't always meant, but are given at times.

Anyone got a replay of Bristol's claim to a handball in the last 5 minutes or so?

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by windermere_royal » 27 Nov 2016 11:09

Strange that all of a sudden we`ve turned whiter than white on this forum. you get some soft ones and you are refused blatant ones. it evens itself out, get over it FFS

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by CountryRoyal » 27 Nov 2016 11:27

Agree with most summaries that we were good and in control first half, but dropped off a bit due to City's increased tempo in the second.

One of the things was obvious was how many times we won the ball back from the opposition hurryingly trying to pass and get forward, partly due to our positioning and pressuring but a lot of the time unforced errors stemming from Bristol's impatience.

Our style of play is so geared up to taking the lead that I wonder how, even after our improvements and string of good results, we'd cope if we went a goal behind. Hope we don't have to find out anytime soon though :lol:

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genome
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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by genome » 27 Nov 2016 12:10

CountryRoyal Agree with most summaries that we were good and in control first half, but dropped off a bit due to City's increased tempo in the second.


Always going to happen when you're 2-0 up at half time.


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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by NewCorkSeth » 27 Nov 2016 12:19

Obviously I didnt go to the game so I can only talk about highlights.
Al-Habsi's save was lovely. Hes like the Championship version of Lloris. Spurs fans are complaining about his distribution at times but he pulls off fantastic saves.
Beerens goal was very well taken. Confident passing in the build up.
Samuel was certainly clipped but it looks to me like the wrong leg goes flying? He manages to take a step with his right leg after the contact and then while on his left he flings it up. Simulated certainly. It almost looks like his natural inclination was to stay on his feet but he made the decision to go to ground.

Edit: Great pass from McShane to lead to the penalty situation!

Edit again: for sure deliberate handball by Harriott at the end. They should have had a penalty.
Last edited by NewCorkSeth on 27 Nov 2016 12:28, edited 1 time in total.

sandman
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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by sandman » 27 Nov 2016 12:23

Or he tried to stay on his feet but was moving at such a pace that he couldn't .

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by NewCorkSeth » 27 Nov 2016 12:34

sandman Or he tried to stay on his feet but was moving at such a pace that he couldn't .

Possibly but as he manages to take a stride on the same leg that flings out and his upper body stays solid I highly doubt it.

Anyone who has had their heel clipped knows how fast you go down. As an egg chaser for 14 years before dislocating my knee I can say without a doubt when your ankle is clipped you wither flop to the ground with the full force of gravity or you have enough strength to pull your leg ahead of you and keep on moving. The fact his upper body stays erect shows, to me, he had ample strength in his legs to power through the contact. For his to fall over after that seems odd.

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Ian Royal
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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by Ian Royal » 27 Nov 2016 12:48

sandman Or he tried to stay on his feet but was moving at such a pace that he couldn't .

:lol:

If that were the case you'd see him stumble, head going down towards the ground as his feet desperately tried to catch up, not arch his back, keeping his head up as his leg shoots back behind him

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by sandman » 27 Nov 2016 13:12

Sorry Ian but if you were there right behind it as I was than you'd have seen that your scenario is not the case.

Sad to see someone who criticises others for having a supposed negative opinion towards our youth players accuse one of our academy graduates of being a cheat.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by WAZZOCK » 27 Nov 2016 13:17

Let's just agree that whilst being soft, it was a decision that you do see given from time to time.

We can't forget that we conceded an extremely soft penalty against Newcastle earlier in the season, and we had a stone wall penalty not given against Burton last week, so they do even themselves out. City will get an iffy one at some point in the campaign I'm sure.

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Re: BFTG-Bristol city.

by marlowuk » 27 Nov 2016 13:43

NewCorkSeth for sure deliberate handball by Harriott at the end. They should have had a penalty.

I agree . I think he had his back to the ref but the lino should have spotted it. With regard to the Samuel 'penalty', I would only add that, as I recall, Dom did not appeal after falling which suggests he didn't dive. There is no point in diving and then not appealing for the foul!!

All in all, though, it was a very entertaining game and just a shame we didn't keep a 5th consecutive clean sheet. Like others I was impressed by Tammy Abraham in attack for them. Only 19 years old, 6' 4" and very skillful with the ball. I'm sure Chelsea will want to hang on to him for the future though!

We probably just deserved the win but no-one, I think, could have argued with a draw. Several Nobbers gave MOM to Paul McShane but one scored him equal lowest mark out of 10 for the whole team! Nothing much else to add to what others have said. Garath McCleary would be my MOM and AAH's time wasting was embarrassing!

It's a pity Fulham couldn't hold onto their half-time lead against Brighton. Let's hope they don't further punish us next Saturday like they did last year!

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