A Steward's viewpoint

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 15:48

I have been looking at these boards for the last year or so now and although some things have been said that I have felt to be totally off the mark, I have never felt the strong urge that I feel now to reply.

First of all, I just want to address the issue about the Sheffield United game. I hope you are all aware that the club, not only knows of the incident of singing "stand up if you hate stewards", but of the other chant that seems to have conveniently been forgotten about here. When a steward, took a seat number from a persistant stander, a large part of the block started shouting expletives and the area roused itself into a chorus of "W**ker" at the steward. This is completely unacceptable. The "stand up if you hate stewards" chant which was out of order anyway can be forgiven, after all although it is harsh, can perhaps see the banter side of it, but to verbally abuse a steward like what happened on Saturday is just bang out of order.

Next issue, the away fans.

The thing I see so much of here is the call for the FC to do something about the standing areas in the away stand. It is true, the away fans do tend to stand for long periods of the game and I can see how this can be seen as unfair as the rest of the home support are told to sit down. However, the point people seem to miss here is that a large proportion of these away fans simply wont be coming back for the next game at the Madejski, whereas the home support want to be there every week. If a large proportion of fans stand in the home end then they will not be allowed into the stadium for the next few games and it is the same with the away fans.

Finally I want to mention the whole steward abuse on here, it's disgusting. The stewards get so much abuse for simply doing a job that they are employed to do. The FA tells the club to make sure its support stays seated, and the club tells the stewards the same thing. As a result if there is persistant standing, a steward has to ask the individuals to sit down, as this is their job given to them by the club. If the steward does not do this then the steward loses his/her job - simple. Just like any other job, if you do not do what your boss tells you then you will get fired - it's the same in every job. The steward then goes and does the job to which he/she has been instructed and they get abuse for doing so. Why should anyone have to put up with that at work?

I am also often amused by the claim that the stewards tell the fans to sit down in moments of excitement. This is completely false. Half the time people are standing to sing. Don't get me wrong, RFC has nothing against fans singing - it improves the atmosphere and personally I enjoy it. However, it seems that people can't sing when they are sat down, only stood up.

I expect a lot of friendly replies

SpaceCruiser · by **SpaceCruiser** » 26 Jan 2007 15:53

Yellow Jackets wrote:Next issue, the away fans.

The thing I see so much of here is the call for the FC to do something about the standing areas in the away stand. It is true, the away fans do tend to stand for long periods of the game and I can see how this can be seen as unfair as the rest of the home support are told to sit down. However, the point people seem to miss here is that a large proportion of these away fans simply wont be coming back for the next game at the Madejski, whereas the home support want to be there every week.

A convenient excuse.

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 15:56

At the end of the day the FA tells RFC how home fans should behave and what will happen if they don't. Whether or not the fans or even the club agrees is immaterial. Despite people's viewpoints, standing is a sensitive issue and this is down to the FA's directives, not the clubs. If the club do not enforce the FA's directives then the club gets punished. Simple as that

Dirk Gently · by **Dirk Gently** » 26 Jan 2007 15:59

It no different to the fact that when a foreign driver commits an offence when driving in the UK they can't really be prosecuted. They can be expelled, but the UK can't give them points on their driving licence or take it away.

So would you say that because a foreign driver doesn't lose their licence when they speed of cause a crash you have freedom to speed, cause crashes, whatever?

The realities of life mean it's harder to control away fans - but that's a world away from some people's view that they get special treatment.

RoyalBlue · by **RoyalBlue** » 26 Jan 2007 16:01

Yellow Jackets wrote:
Next issue, the away fans.

The thing I see so much of here is the call for the FC to do something about the standing areas in the away stand. It is true, the away fans do tend to stand for long periods of the game and I can see how this can be seen as unfair as the rest of the home support are told to sit down. However, the point people seem to miss here is that a large proportion of these away fans simply wont be coming back for the next game at the Madejski, whereas the home support want to be there every week. If a large proportion of fans stand in the home end then they will not be allowed into the stadium for the next few games and it is the same with the away fans.

As I mention below I managed to edit out my initial reply (fool!) so let's see how good my memory is:

Here's a friendly response for you! This is the same old shyte that the club usually come out with (or are you actually the less popular Doyle from RFC?). If that's all you can come out with, it's really not worth you bothering.

How the **** does the fact that a large proportion of away fans won't be coming back make their standing (and you acknowledge they stand for long periods of time) make it any safer or excusable?

'I'm sorry Officer, I know I was speeding and it is unsafe but I won't be coming back along this road again'!

Either standing is against the regulations and unsafe, as the club keep claiming, or it is not! The rules should be equally enforced for both sets of supporters and seeing people turfed out, even if only for that game, would hopefully discourage some of the other away supporters from standing.

Dirk Gently wrote:It no different to the fact that when a foreign driver commits an offence when driving in the UK they can't really be prosecuted. They can be expelled, but the UK can't give them points on their driving licence or take it away.

So would you say that because a foreign driver doesn't lose their licence when they speed of cause a crash you have freedom to speed, cause crashes, whatever?

The realities of life mean it's harder to control away fans - but that's a world away from some people's view that they get special treatment.

Sorry Dirk that is crap! It is not harder to control away fans but clearly you''ve sat hearing that excuse from the club so many times that you're actually starting to believe it!

If you have spent ggod time and money travelling to support your team at an away match, you normally want to see the game! Seeing people slung out for standing is likely to discourage you from doing the same.

As for foreign drivers, I believe steps have/are being taken to close a lot of those loopholes. What a shame the club can't be bothered to do the same with away supporters but instead just concentrate on briefing STAR to pass on their threats to home supporters.

Here's a friendly response then! That's the usual load of shyte that the club come out with (or are you the somewhat less popular Doyle at RFC?), and if you can't better that then it's not really worth you bothering.

How the **** does the fact that a large proportion of away fans won't be coming back make their standing (and you acknowledge they stand for long periods of time) make it any safer or excusable?

'Yes officer, I know I was speeding and it is unsafe but I won't be coming back down this road again'!

Either standing is against the regulations and unsafe, as the club keep claiming, or it is not! The rules should be equally enforced for both sets of supporters and seeing people turfed out, even if only for that game, would hopefully discourage some of the other away supporters from standing.

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 16:05

As has been pointed out, it is infinitely more difficult to control away fans who simply don't care if they get banned. Just because you don't see them being physically removed doesn't mean they aren't dealt with. Persistant home standers aren't dealt with at the time, they recieve a letter in the post after the game informing them they aren't welcome for the next however many games.

I can see the anger on this issue, but we're not perfect

Dirk Gently · by **Dirk Gently** » 26 Jan 2007 16:06

RoyalBlue wrote: How the **** does the fact that a large proportion of away fans won't be coming back make their standing (and you acknowledge they stand for long periods of time) make it any safer or excusable?

No-one ever said it was either safer of excusable - just harder to take action against. So instead of saying "we can't enforce it properly with away fans so we won't bother to try with home fans" the club uses whatever means they've got. They do have more powers with home fans - so they use them. That's life!

RoyalBlue wrote: Either standing is against the regulations and unsafe, as the club keep claiming, or it is not! The rules should be equally enforced for both sets of supporters and seeing people turfed out, even if only for that game, would hopefully discourage some of the other away supporters from standing.

I don't think the club has ever actually claimed that standing is unsafe. The terms of their licence to operate means that they have to stop people standing - as simple as that!

Seal · by **Seal** » 26 Jan 2007 16:06

RoyalBlue 1 Yellow Jacket 0

End of the day Stewards are like traffic wardens. Surely you must know when you take the job that you're not going to be universally loved.

I often think to myself....why would anyone want to be a steward!?

RoyalBlue · by **RoyalBlue** » 26 Jan 2007 16:08

B*gger deleted my original when I tried to edit it with the point in response to Dirk!

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 16:08

RoyalBlue wrote: Either standing is against the regulations and unsafe, as the club keep claiming, or it is not! The rules should be equally enforced for both sets of supporters and seeing people turfed out, even if only for that game, would hopefully discourage some of the other away supporters from standing.

[quote ="Dirk Gently"] I don't think the club has ever actually claimed that standing is unsafe. The terms of their licence to operate means that they have to stop people standing - as simple as that![/quote]

At the end of the day the FA tells RFC how home fans should behave and what will happen if they don't. Whether or not the fans or even the club agrees is immaterial. Despite people's viewpoints, standing is a sensitive issue and this is down to the FA's directives, not the clubs. If the club do not enforce the FA's directives then the club gets punished. Simple as that

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 16:10

Seal wrote:RoyalBlue 1 Yellow Jacket 0

End of the day Stewards are like traffic wardens. Surely you must know when you take the job that you're not going to be universally loved.

I often think to myself....why would anyone want to be a steward!?

I agree, we are all aware we are not everyones favourite people and expect a bit of stick for doing our jobs

But the abuse on Saturday is inexcusable

RoyalBlue · by **RoyalBlue** » 26 Jan 2007 16:11

Yellow Jackets wrote:As has been pointed out, it is infinitely more difficult to control away fans who simply don't care if they get banned. Just because you don't see them being physically removed doesn't mean they aren't dealt with. Persistant home standers aren't dealt with at the time, they recieve a letter in the post after the game informing them they aren't welcome for the next however many games.

I can see the anger on this issue, but we're not perfect

Too damn right - the club are nowhere near being that on this issue and so far all you've managed to do is highlight yet more imperfections!

You don't have to ban the away supporters you just have to prevent them seeing the game they have travelled to and paid to see - pretty fine deterrent for most of them.

We keep hearing all this stuff about the 'stealth ejections' of away supporters but how about backing it up with some evidence/facts? How many away supporters have been ejected for standing this season?

Huntley & Palmer · by **Huntley & Palmer** » 26 Jan 2007 16:11

Could someone please clarify exactly how many instances of punishment have been handed out to clubs where fans have been persistently standing. The reason I ask is down to the fact that I believe this FA directive to be a fairly hollow threat, and that in reality they know that they are almost powerless to stop it. Every ground in the country must have an issue with persistent standing in both the home and away ends.

I do not condone any verbal abuse of stewards, as mentioned they are just doing a relatively low paid job and with little reward.

Skin · by **Skin** » 26 Jan 2007 16:13

Yellow Jackets wrote:At the end of the day the FA tells RFC how home fans should behave and what will happen if they don't. Whether or not the fans or even the club agrees is immaterial. Despite people's viewpoints, standing is a sensitive issue and this is down to the FA's directives, not the clubs. If the club do not enforce the FA's directives then the club gets punished. Simple as that

Why do the club have to be so far up the FA's arse all the time on this issue??
They could at least acknowledge they're fighting a losing battle and ask the FA what they can do about it to help the fans that do want to stand. Fans used to be the most important part of the game, now it all comes down to Â£Â£Â£ and keeping the FA happy in order to maximise the revenue, and I would guess that this issue is no different?
Good luck with your job but I think the 'talk to the hand because the face ain't listening' approach will only make matters worse. FACT.

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 16:14

I do not have the stats i'm afraid, I just turn up and try to do my job and the people upstairs look after that sort of stuff.

Would you really want to test the water of the FA's threats?

Yellow Jackets · by **Yellow Jackets** » 26 Jan 2007 16:16

Look, i'm not here to try and change your views, i'd lose that battle straight away, I only wanted to make you aware and possibly understand that the abuse stewards get is out of order.

The issues you have with standing should be taken up with the FA or the club, not the men and women who turn up on a saturday to do they job they are told to

Dirk Gently · by **Dirk Gently** » 26 Jan 2007 16:16

Huntley & Palmer wrote:Could someone please clarify exactly how many instances of punishment have been handed out to clubs where fans have been persistently standing. The reason I ask is down to the fact that I believe this FA directive to be a fairly hollow threat, and that in reality they know that they are almost powerless to stop it. Every ground in the country must have an issue with persistent standing in both the home and away ends.

Some grounds are better/worse than others - certainly away allocations for some clubs have been reduced, although I thought this was via the FLA (through the local council, who administer each club's licence) rather than through the FA.

I'll try and get definitive figures.

Skin · by **Skin** » 26 Jan 2007 16:17

Yellow Jackets wrote:I do not have the stats i'm afraid, I just turn up and try to do my job and the people upstairs look after that sort of stuff.

Would you really want to test the water of the FA's threats?

I would love just one club to have the balls to represent the fans on this issue and not bottle it at the first hurdle.

Seal · by **Seal** » 26 Jan 2007 16:20

Yellow Jackets wrote:Look, i'm not here to try and change your views, i'd lose that battle straight away, I only wanted to make you aware and possibly understand that the abuse stewards get is out of order.

The issues you have with standing should be taken up with the FA or the club, not the men and women who turn up on a saturday to do they job they are told to

I think everyone on here will accept that abusing stewards is out of order, and I'm sorry you had to deal with that.

Would you however accept that some stewards themselves need to take a look at the way they deal with fans. Some of them are just plain rude and are quite clearly failed applicants for the police service on a power trip. It normally takes two parties for a confrontation to start...

RoyalBlue · by **RoyalBlue** » 26 Jan 2007 16:21

Huntley & Palmer wrote:Could someone please clarify exactly how many instances of punishment have been handed out to clubs where fans have been persistently standing. The reason I ask is down to the fact that I believe this FA directive to be a fairly hollow threat, and that in reality they know that they are almost powerless to stop it. Every ground in the country must have an issue with persistent standing in both the home and away ends.

Quite right, watch any UK match on the TV and you will see that virtually every other club in the country has a bigger problem with persistent standing (and, I suspect, in most cases are quite happy to tolerate it) than RFC.

I suspect that if we were to transfer the older Doyle to another club we might see a different approach both at the Mad Stad and at his lucky new employers.